Transcript
Interview with Channel One and Associated Press
English includes full house translations. Review is pending; untranslated passages and selected digest glosses remain labelled.
| Русский | English |
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| Д.Данишевски: Большое спасибо за то, что Вы пригласили нас сюда, в Ваш дом, и за то, что согласились ответить на вопросы для широкой аудитории Ассошиэйтед Пресс. Скоро на этой неделе пройдёт саммит «двадцатки», и это очень интересно. Я хотел бы начать с Сирии. Президент Обама сейчас говорит, что он ждёт одобрения Конгресса до того, как начать операцию в Сирии. Как Вы полагаете, что случилось там относительно химической атаки и что должно быть сделано на этот счёт? |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: Thank you very much for inviting us here to your home and for agreeing to answer questions for the Associated Press audience. The G- twenty summit will take place soon this week, and that is very interesting. I would like to begin with Syria. President Obama is now saying that he is waiting for Congressional approval before starting an operation in Syria. What do you think happened there regarding the chemical attack and what should be done about it? |
| Matching Russian passage has not been identified |
Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Novo-Ogaryovo, Moscow Region |
| Matching Russian passage has not been identified | John Daniszewski: Thank you for inviting us into your home and for answering questions for the AP’s worldwide audience. I know this is a very busy week for you – you have so many world leaders at the G20 meetings this week, and it’s much appreciated. If I may, I’d like to begin with the story of Syria. President Obama says he will wait until getting Congress’ approval before moving on Syria. What do you believe should happen there? What do you believe happened there as far as the chemical weapons’ attack goes? What should be done about it? |
| 1 Skepticism About the Syrian Government Chemical Attack | |
| В.Путин: У нас нет точных сведений, что произошло. Мы считаем, что как минимум нужно дождаться результатов исследований, которые провела комиссия инспекторов Организации Объединённых Наций. Но у нас нет данных о том, что эти химические вещества – ещё не известно, это оружие химическое или просто какие‑то химические вредные вещества – были применены именно сирийской официальной правительственной армией. Более того, я уже об этом говорил, на наш взгляд, кажется совершенно нелепым, чтобы регулярные вооружённые силы, которые на самом деле сегодня атакуют, в некоторых местах они так называемых повстанцев просто окружили и их добивают по сути, – чтобы они в этих условиях начали применять запрещённое химическое оружие, понимая прекрасно, что это может быть поводом для принятия к ним санкций вплоть до применения силы. Это просто нелепо, это не укладывается ни в какую логику, это во‑первых. Во‑вторых, мы исходим из того, что если у кого‑то есть сведения о том, что химическое оружие было применено, и было применено именно регулярной армией, то эти доказательства должны быть представлены в Совет Безопасности Организации Объединённых Наций. Инспекторам и в Совет Безопасности. И они должны быть убедительными. Они не должны основываться на каких‑то слухах или на информации, полученной спецслужбами в результате какой‑то подслушки, каких‑то разговоров и прочее, и тому подобное. Даже в Соединённых Штатах есть эксперты, которые считают, что представленные администрацией доказательства не являются убедительными и не исключают возможности того, что оппозиция провела заранее запланированную провокационную акцию, пытаясь дать своим покровителям повод для вооружённого вмешательства. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: We have no exact information about what happened. We consider that at a minimum one must await the results of the studies carried out by the commission of inspectors of the United Nations. But we have no data that these chemical substances — it is not yet known whether this is a chemical weapon or simply some harmful chemical substances — were used precisely by the official Syrian government army. Moreover, I have already spoken of this: in our view it seems completely absurd that regular armed forces, which are in fact on the attack today, and in some places have simply surrounded the so-called rebels and are in essence finishing them off — that they in these conditions would begin to use a prohibited chemical weapon, understanding perfectly well that this may be a ground for sanctions against them up to and including the use of force. This is simply absurd; it fits no logic; that is the first thing. Second, we proceed from the view that if someone has information that a chemical weapon was used, and was used precisely by the regular army, then this evidence must be presented to the Security Council of the United Nations. To the inspectors and to the Security Council. And it must be convincing. It must not be based on some rumors or on information obtained by the special services as a result of some eavesdropping, some conversations, and so on and so forth. Even in the United States there are experts who consider that the evidence presented by the administration is not convincing and does not exclude the possibility that the opposition carried out a provocation planned in advance, trying to give its patrons a pretext for armed intervention. |
| 2 Evidence Must Go to the UN Security Council | |
| Д.Данишевски: Мы видели видеоматериалы, где показаны дети, которые страдают от отравления. Вы тоже видели это видео? Какова Ваша реакция? Если есть сведения о том, что химическое оружие было применено, и было применено именно регулярной армией, то эти доказательства должны быть представлены в Совет Безопасности Организации Объединённых Наций. И они должны быть убедительными. |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: We have seen video footage showing children suffering from poisoning. Have you also seen this video? What is your reaction? If there is information that chemical weapons were used and that they were used by the regular army, then these proofs must be presented to the United Nations Security Council. And they must be convincing. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified John Daniszewski: If I may follow up, the video was so dramatic showing the suffering children and people gasping for air. Did you look at that video and what was your reaction to it? |
| В.Путин: Что касается тех материалов, видеоматериалов, о которых Вы сейчас упомянули, на которых изображены убитые дети, и якобы они были убиты в результате этой химатаки, то это ужасные кадры. Вопрос только в том, кто и что сделал, и кто в этом виноват. Сами эти кадры не дают ответов на те вопросы, которые я сейчас поставил. И есть мнение, что это компиляция тех же самых боевиков, которые, как мы хорошо знаем, и администрация США это признает, связаны с «Аль‑Каидой» и которые всегда отличались своей особой жестокостью. Вместе с тем обращаю Ваше внимание на то, если Вы внимательно смотрели на эти кадры, в кадрах нет ни родителей, ни женщин, ни медицинского персонала. Что это за люди и что там произошло? Ответа на этот вопрос нет. И сами эти фотографии являются, безусловно, ужасными, но они не доказывают чью‑либо виновность. Разумеется, это подлежит расследованию, и хорошо было бы узнать тех, кто совершил эти злодеяния. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: As for the materials, the video materials you have just mentioned, which show children who have been killed, and which allegedly show that they were killed as a result of this chemical attack, these are terrible frames. The only question is who did what, and who is to blame. These frames themselves give no answers to the questions I have just put. And there is a view that this is a compilation by those same militants who, as we know well, and as the United States administration acknowledges, are linked to al-Qaeda, and who have always been distinguished by a particular cruelty. At the same time I draw your attention to this: if you looked at these frames attentively, there are in the frames neither parents, nor women, nor medical personnel. Who are these people, and what happened there? There is no answer to that question. And these photographs themselves are of course terrible, but they do not prove anyone's guilt. Of course this is subject to investigation, and it would be good to learn who committed these atrocities. |
| Д.Данишевски: Какой будет российская позиция, если будут представлены точные доказательства, что эти атаки проведены правительством Сирии? Вы согласитесь с нашей военной операцией? |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: What will be the Russian position if exact evidence is presented that these attacks were carried out by the Syrian government? Will you agree with our military operation? |
| В.Путин: Я этого не исключаю. Но хочу обратить Ваше внимание на одно абсолютно принципиальное обстоятельство. В соответствии с действующим международным правом санкцию на применение оружия в отношении суверенного государства может дать только Совет Безопасности Организации Объединённых Наций. Любые другие поводы, способы, которые оправдывали бы применение силы в отношении независимого и суверенного государства, недопустимы, и их нельзя квалифицировать иначе как агрессию. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: I do not rule this out. But I want to draw your attention to one absolutely fundamental circumstance. Under international law as it stands, only the Security Council of the United Nations can authorize the use of weapons against a sovereign state. Any other pretexts or methods that would justify the use of force against an independent and sovereign state are inadmissible, and they cannot be described as anything other than aggression. |
| Д.Данишевски: Я понимаю Ваши доводы, и в этой связи мне интересно, что существует вопрос о том, кто именно совершил эти преступления. А что сделает Россия, она дистанцируется от правительства Сирии, она прекратит поставки оружия и так далее? |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: I understand your arguments, and in this regard I am interested in the fact that there is a question about who exactly committed these crimes. And what will Russia do, will it distance itself from the Syrian government, will it stop arms supplies and so on? |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified John Daniszewski: I see your reasoning in this regard but I do wonder when there’s a question mark about who committed these crimes. Whether Russia should distance itself from the Assad government and maybe hold up its shipments of arms, something like that. ”In line with existing international law, only the United Nations Security Council could sanction the use of force against a sovereign state. Any other pretext or method to justify the use of force against an independent sovereign state is inadmissible and can only be interpreted as an aggression.“ |
| В.Путин: Если у нас будут объективные, точные данные о том, кто совершил эти преступления, тогда будет реакция. Сейчас предполагать и заранее сказать: да, мы будем делать то или это – было бы абсолютно некорректно, в политике так не поступают. Но я вас уверяю, что мы займём принципиальную позицию. Хочу сказать, что принципиальность этой позиции заключается в том, что применение средств массового уничтожения людей является преступлением. Но возникает и другой вопрос. Если будет установлено, что это боевики применяют средства массового уничтожения, что будут делать США с боевиками? Что будут делать эти спонсоры с боевиками? Прекратят поставки оружия? Начнут против них боевые действия? |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: If we have objective, exact data on who committed these crimes, then there will be a reaction. To suppose now, and to say in advance, yes, we will do this or that, would be absolutely incorrect; that is not how one acts in politics. But I assure you that we will take a principled position. I want to say that what makes this position principled is that the use of means of mass destruction of people is a crime. But another question also arises. If it is established that it is the militants who are using means of mass destruction, what will the United States do with the militants? What will these sponsors do with the militants? Will they stop supplies of weapons? Will they begin combat operations against them? |
| Д.Данишевски: Я полагаю, что, по мнению Джона Керри, все понимают, почему совершаются эти преступления. И нам необходимо ответить перед историей, и вы, Россия, могли бы быть включены в этот процесс, как и США. Боитесь ли Вы, что Вас сейчас могут расценить как поддерживающего этот режим, который совершает преступление против своего народа? Есть ли опасность, что Вы будете расцениваться как защитник этого правительства? |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: I believe that, in John Kerry's opinion, everyone understands why these crimes are committed. And we need to answer history, and you, Russia, could be included in this process, just like the USA. Are you afraid that you might now be seen as supporting this regime, which is committing a crime against its own people? Is there a danger that you will be seen as a defender of this government? |
| 3 Defending International Law, Not Assad | |
| В.Путин: Мы не защищаем это правительство. Мы защищаем совершенно другие вещи: мы защищаем нормы и принципы международного права, мы защищаем современный миропорядок, мы защищаем обсуждение даже возможности применения силы исключительно в рамках действующего международного порядка, международных правил и международного права. Вот мы что защищаем, вот это является абсолютной ценностью. Когда вопросы, связанные с применением силы, решаются за рамками ООН и Совета Безопасности, тогда возникает опасение того, что вот такие неправовые решения могут быть применены в отношении кого угодно и под любым предлогом. В соответствии с действующим международным правом санкцию на применение оружия в отношении суверенного государства может дать только Совет Безопасности Организации Объединённых Наций. Любые другие поводы, которые оправдывали бы применение силы в отношении независимого и суверенного государства, недопустимы, и их нельзя квалифицировать иначе как агрессию. Вот сейчас Вы сказали о том, что господин Керри считает, что химоружие применила армия Асада, но точно так же другой госсекретарь в администрации господина Буша убеждал всё международное сообщество в том, что в Ираке есть химическое оружие, и даже показывал нам какую‑то пробирку с белым порошком. Всё это оказалось несостоятельным аргументом, но тем не менее с использованием этого аргумента была проведена военная акция, которую многие сегодня в США называют ошибочной. Мы что, это забыли, что ли? Мы разве исходим из того, что новых ошибок можно вот так спокойно избежать? Я Вас уверяю, что это не так. Все об этом помнят, имеют в виду и учитывают при принятии решений. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: We are not defending this government. We are defending completely different things: we are defending the norms and principles of international law, we are defending the modern world order, we are defending the discussion of even the possibility of the use of force exclusively within the framework of the existing international order, international rules, and international law. That is what we are defending; that is an absolute value. When questions connected with the use of force are decided outside the UN and the Security Council, then there arises the fear that such unlawful decisions may be applied in relation to anyone at all and under any pretext. In accordance with existing international law, a sanction for the use of weapons against a sovereign state can be given only by the Security Council of the United Nations. Any other grounds that would justify the use of force against an independent and sovereign state are inadmissible, and they cannot be qualified otherwise than as aggression. Just now you said that Mr. Kerry considers that chemical weapons were used by Assad's army, but in exactly the same way another secretary of state in the administration of Mr. Bush convinced the whole international community that there were chemical weapons in Iraq, and even showed us some test tube with white powder. All of this turned out to be an untenable argument, but nevertheless a military action was carried out using this argument, which many people in the United States today call mistaken. Have we forgotten this, then? Do we proceed from the view that new mistakes can just calmly be avoided in this way? I assure you that this is not so. Everyone remembers this, bears it in mind, and takes it into account when taking decisions. |
| Д.Данишевски: Насколько я понимаю, Вы не примете тех доказательств, которые были сейчас представлены. Так что Вас убедит? |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: As far as I understand, you will not accept the evidence that has been presented now. So what will convince you? |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified John Daniszewski: So, I understand that you will not accept the evidence that has been offered so far as convincing. What would it take to convince you? ”When issues related to the use of force are dealt with outside the framework of the UN and Security Council, then there’s risk that such unlawful decisions might be applied against anybody and on any pretext.“ |
| В.Путин: Нас убедит глубокое предметное исследование вопроса и наличие именно доказательств, которые бы были очевидными и которые бы со всей очевидностью доказали, кто применял и какие средства были использованы. После этого мы будем готовы действовать самым решительным и серьёзным образом. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: What will convince us is a thorough, substantive study of the question and the presence of precisely the evidence that would be obvious and that would prove with full clarity who used them and what means were used. After that we will be ready to act in the most decisive and serious way. |
| К.Клеймёнов: Владимир Владимирович, продолжает ли сейчас Россия исполнять контракты на поставку и обслуживание сирийской техники? |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: Vladimir Vladimirovich, is Russia currently continuing to fulfill contracts for the supply and maintenance of Syrian equipment? |
| В.Путин: Да, конечно. Мы делаем это и исходим из того, что мы сотрудничаем с легитимным правительством и при этом не нарушаем никаких норм международного права, никаких наших обязательств. Нет никаких ограничений, наложенных ООН, на поставки в Сирию оружия. И нам очень жаль, что поставки боевикам осуществляются в полном объёме и с первых шагов этого вооружённого конфликта, хотя в соответствии с нормами международного права поставки оружия конфликтующей стране недопустимы. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: Yes, of course. We do this, and we proceed from the fact that we are cooperating with the legitimate government and are not, in doing so, violating any norms of international law or any of our obligations. There are no restrictions, imposed by the UN, on supplies of weapons to Syria. And we very much regret that supplies to the militants are being carried out in full and from the first steps of this armed conflict, although under the norms of international law supplies of weapons to a country that is a party to a conflict are inadmissible. |
| К.Клеймёнов: Позвольте, я всё‑таки уточню по поводу современнейших комплексов С‑300. |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: Allow me to clarify regarding the most modern S-300 complexes. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Kirill Kleymenov: Mr President, what place do you think will the Syrian issue take on the agenda of the G20 summit? Our conversation takes place just before this big meeting in St Petersburg. |
| В.Путин: Пожалуйста. Вокруг этого много разговоров: всё‑таки поставила Россия Сирии эти комплексы или нет? |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: Please. There is a lot of talk around this: did Russia supply these systems to Syria after all, or not? |
| 4 Arms Supplies and the S-300 | |
| В.Путин: С‑300 – это не современнейшие комплексы. Они, правда, думаю, по своим параметрам несколько лучше, чем «Пэтриот», но у нас есть уже и С‑400, и С‑500 на подходе. Это очень эффективное оружие, безусловно. У нас есть контракт на поставку С‑300, мы отдельные компоненты поставили, но вся поставка не завершена, мы пока её приостановили. Но если мы увидим, что предпринимаются какие‑то шаги, связанные с нарушением действующих международных норм, то мы подумаем, как нам поступать в будущем, в том числе и с поставками таких чувствительных вооружений в отдельные регионы мира. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: The S-300 is not among the most modern systems. They are, I think, somewhat better in their parameters than the Patriot, it is true, but we already have the S-400 as well, and the S-500 is on the way. This is very effective weaponry, without question. We have a contract for the supply of the S-300; we have supplied individual components, but the delivery as a whole has not been completed, and for now we have suspended it. But if we see that some steps are being taken that are connected with a breach of the international norms in force, then we will think about how we are to act in future, including with supplies of such sensitive armaments to particular regions of the world. |
| К.Клеймёнов: Руководители многих государств заявили, что ни при каких условиях их страны не будут ввязываться в этот конфликт. Можете ли Вы сказать нечто подобное? |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: Leaders of many states declared that under no circumstances their countries would become involved in this conflict. Can you say something similar? |
| 5 Russia Will Not Intervene; a Strengthening Multipolar World | |
| В.Путин: Я обращаю ваше внимание на то, что подразделений армии Российской Федерации за рубежом в настоящее время нет, кроме двух баз на территории бывшего Советского Союза и участия наших миротворцев в операциях в рамках мандатов ООН. И это очень хорошо, мы этому очень рады. Мы, разумеется, не собираемся и не будем ввязываться ни в какие конфликты. Когда вопросы, связанные с применением силы, решаются за рамками ООН и Совета Безопасности, тогда возникает опасение того, что неправовые решения могут быть применены в отношении кого угодно и под любым предлогом. Что касается решения ряда стран не принимать участия в военной операции, откровенно говоря, это меня очень удивило, потому что я считал, что уже в западном сообществе всё делается по принципам определённого единообразия, похожим на решения, которые принимались на съездах коммунистической партии Советского Союза. Но оказалось, что это не так. Есть, оказывается, люди, которые дорожат своим суверенитетом, анализируют ситуацию и набираются мужества принимать решения в интересах своих собственных стран, отстаивают свою точку зрения. Это очень хорошо, это говорит о том, что мир действительно укрепляется в своей многополярности. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: I draw your attention to the fact that there are at present no units of the army of the Russian Federation abroad, except for two bases on the territory of the former Soviet Union and the participation of our peacekeepers in operations under UN mandates. And that is very good; we are very glad of it. We of course do not intend, and will not, get involved in any conflicts. When questions connected with the use of force are decided outside the framework of the UN and the Security Council, then there arises the fear that unlawful decisions may be applied to anyone at all and on any pretext. As for the decision of a number of countries not to take part in the military operation, frankly this surprised me very much, because I had thought that in the Western community everything was already done on principles of a certain uniformity, resembling the decisions taken at the congresses of the Communist Party of the Soviet Union. But it turned out that this is not so. There are, it turns out, people who value their sovereignty, analyze the situation, and find the courage to take decisions in the interests of their own countries and to defend their point of view. This is very good; it says that the world really is growing firmer in its multipolarity. |
| К.Клеймёнов: Владимир Владимирович, а какое место, по‑вашему, сирийская проблематика будет занимать в повестке саммита «большой двадцатки»? Мы встречаемся с Вами как раз в преддверии этой большой встречи в Петербурге. |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: Vladimir Vladimirovich, in your opinion, what place will the Syrian issue occupy on the agenda of the G-? summit? We are meeting with you right on the eve of this major meeting in St. Petersburg. |
| Matching Russian passage has not been identified |
Cached English source — passage alignment not verified John Daniszewski: President Putin, I would like to get on to the subject of US-Russian relations but before I do, can I ask one more question about Syria. Supposing President Obama gets the support of Congress for some military actions and other countries go along, what would Russia do? Will you fight for Syria or you would be rifting relations with Syria? What’s your reaction going to be? |
| В.Путин: Прежде всего хочу сказать, что повестка G‑20 давно сформирована, и мы обговорили эту повестку дня со всеми нашими партнёрами. Мы не считаем себя вправе нарушать эти договорённости. Саммит «двадцатки» посвящён прежде всего и главным образом обсуждению вопросов экономического порядка, экономических проблем в мире, посвящён проблемам роста, борьбы с безработицей, с коррупцией, с налоговыми преступлениями, администрированию. Но, конечно, имея в виду, что ситуация вокруг Сирии является острой, конфликтной, и нам пока не удаётся согласовать все позиции по этой очень важной проблеме, можно воспользоваться тем, что лидеры 20 ведущих экономик мира соберутся в Петербурге, и, разумеется, можно уделить какое‑то время обсуждению этой темы. Но навязывать это мы не будем, мы можем предложить выйти за рамки намеченных обсуждений и какое‑то время посвятить обсуждению сирийской проблемы. Хочу ещё раз подчеркнуть, мы хозяева саммита, там действуют определённые правила, есть согласованная повестка, и мы считаем себя не вправе лично вносить туда какие‑то изменения. Но я, безусловно, предложу коллегам пообсуждать эту тему. Надеюсь, они не откажутся. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: First of all I want to say that the G-20 agenda was formed long ago, and we have talked this agenda through with all our partners. We do not consider ourselves entitled to break these understandings. The summit of the Twenty is devoted above all and chiefly to discussing questions of an economic order, the economic problems in the world; it is devoted to the problems of growth, of fighting unemployment, corruption, tax crimes, and administration. But of course, bearing in mind that the situation around Syria is acute and conflictual, and that we have not yet managed to align all positions on this very important problem, one can make use of the fact that the leaders of the 20 leading economies of the world will gather in Petersburg, and of course one can devote some time to discussing this subject. But we will not impose it; we can propose going beyond the discussions that have been planned and devoting some time to the Syrian problem. I want to stress once more: we are the hosts of the summit, certain rules operate there, there is an agreed agenda, and we do not consider ourselves entitled personally to introduce any changes into it. But I will certainly propose to my colleagues that we discuss this subject. I hope they will not refuse. |
| К.Клеймёнов: Что для Вас будет успехом саммита? |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: What will be success for you at the summit? |
| Matching Russian passage has not been identified |
Cached English source — passage alignment not verified John Daniszewski: Ok. Well, let me ask you about President Obama’s visit. You know, we should be sitting here today discussing the summit with the President that was due to start today. Are you disappointed that the visit was cancelled? Do you see it as being a snub of some kind? |
| 6 The G20 Summit Focused on the Economy | |
| В.Путин: Успехом саммита будет открытая позитивная дискуссия, направленная на окончательное принятие подготовленных решений. Какие это решения? Это набор мер, направленных на стимулирование роста мировой экономики, на создание новых рабочих мест. Вот это два основных, генеральных направления. При этом мы исходим из того, что для того, чтобы обеспечить решение этих важнейших задач, нам необходимо решить несколько подзадач, которыми являются стимулирование инвестиций, придание мировой экономике большей открытости, работа в сфере, как я уже говорил, налогового администрирования, банковской системы и так далее и тому подобное. Кстати говоря, что касается налогового администрирования и совершенствования налоговой системы – проблема ухода от налогов, это отчасти касается борьбы с коррупцией. Вот что нам удалось, как я полагаю, согласовать – но делали это мы не сами, а вместе с нашими партнёрами и коллегами под патронатом ОЭСР, – согласовать основные принципы развития налоговой системы в мире. Этого никто не делал за последние сто лет. И это очень важная составляющая нашей работы. Саммит «двадцатки» посвящён прежде всего обсуждению экономических проблем в мире. Но, конечно, имея в виду, что ситуация вокруг Сирии является острой, конфликтной, можно воспользоваться тем, что лидеры 20 ведущих экономик мира соберутся в Петербурге, и уделить время обсуждению этой темы. Подготовлен так называемый «Петербургский план» развития мировой экономики и создания новых рабочих мест. Мы договорились по ряду других позиций, связанных с борьбой с коррупцией, мы договорились о том, что нужно делать в борьбе с офшорами. Там целый набор, большой набор мер. Да, конечно, будем обсуждать проблемы мировой торговли, мировых финансов, и мы будем считать, что саммит прошёл успешно, если все подготовленные заранее и заранее согласованные документы будут приняты. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: The success of the summit will be an open, positive discussion directed toward the final adoption of the prepared decisions. What are these decisions? They are a set of measures directed at stimulating the growth of the world economy and at creating new jobs. These are the two main, general directions. At the same time we proceed from the view that, in order to ensure the solution of these most important tasks, we need to solve several sub-tasks, which are the stimulation of investment, giving the world economy greater openness, and work in the sphere, as I have already said, of tax administration, the banking system, and so on and so forth. By the way, as regards tax administration and the improvement of the tax system, the problem of tax evasion in part concerns the fight against corruption. Here is what we succeeded, as I suppose, in agreeing — but we did not do this ourselves, but together with our partners and colleagues under the patronage of the OECD — in agreeing the basic principles of the development of the tax system in the world. No one has done this in the last one hundred years. And this is a very important component of our work. The summit of the Twenty is devoted above all to the discussion of economic problems in the world. But, of course, having in mind that the situation around Syria is acute and conflictual, one can take advantage of the fact that the leaders of 20 leading economies of the world will gather in St. Petersburg, and devote time to discussing this topic. A so-called St. Petersburg Plan has been prepared for the development of the world economy and the creation of new jobs. We have agreed on a number of other positions connected with the fight against corruption; we have agreed on what must be done in the fight against offshore zones. There is a whole set there, a large set of measures. Yes, of course we will discuss the problems of world trade and world finance, and we will consider that the summit has passed successfully if all the documents prepared in advance and agreed in advance are adopted. |
| К.Клеймёнов: Я правильно Вас понял, что кроме инициирования собственно дискуссии по этим ключевым темам, России есть что предложить нашим гостям в решении отдельных проблем, о которых Вы говорили? |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: Did I understand you correctly that, besides initiating the discussion itself on these key topics, Russia has something to offer our guests in solving the individual problems you mentioned? |
| Matching Russian passage has not been identified |
Cached English source — passage alignment not verified John Daniszewski: There have been some speculations about your personal chemistry with President Obama, your relationship. He was quoted as saying that, making some remarks about your body language, saying that you were slouching or looking bored. I was wondering how you took those remarks? Do you feel that was too personal and appropriate or..? What was your reaction? ”The President of the United States is a very good interlocutor, he is easy to talk to, because it is clear what he wants, he has a clear position, he pays attention to the position of his interlocutor, his opponent, he reacts to it. It is interesting for me to work with him.“ |
| В.Путин: Вы знаете, мы же председательствуем в течение года, саммит «большой двадцатки» – это как бы квинтэссенция, завершение всей этой совместной работы в течение года на уровне министров, экспертов и так далее. И вот в ходе этих совместных дискуссий, конечно, мы что‑то предлагали, нам что‑то предлагали. Это была такая совместная работа, такая общая «кухня», на которой готовился «пирог» для лидеров «двадцатки», которые должны поставить свои подписи под окончательными документами. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: You know, we are after all holding the chair for a year; the summit of the big twenty is, as it were, the quintessence, the completion of all this joint work over the course of the year at the level of ministers, experts, and so on. And in the course of these joint discussions we of course proposed some things, and some things were proposed to us. It was joint work of that kind, a shared "kitchen" on which a "pie" was prepared for the leaders of the twenty, who are to put their signatures to the final documents. |
| Д.Данишевски: Господин Президент, давайте вернёмся к вопросу взаимоотношений между США и Россией. Но позвольте задать ещё один вопрос касаемо Сирии. Предположим, что Президент Обама получит поддержку Конгресса на применение насильственных, силовых действий. Что сделает Россия в таком случае? Будете ли вы на стороне Сирии или вы прервёте отношения с Сирией? Что вы сделаете в таком случае? |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: Mr. President, let us return to the question of relations between the United States and Russia. But allow me to ask one more question regarding Syria. Suppose that President Obama receives support from Congress for the use of violent, forceful actions. What will Russia do in such a case? Will you be on the side of Syria or will you sever relations with Syria? What will you do in such a case? |
| В.Путин: Вы работаете в средстве массовой информации или ЦРУ? Вы мне задаёте вопросы, которые должны задавать коллеги из других ведомств. Это планы России в случае развития ситуации по одному, по второму либо по третьему сценарию. У нас есть свои представления о том, что и как мы будем делать в случае развития ситуации либо с применением оружия, либо без применения. У нас есть свои планы, но пока говорить об этом рано. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: Do you work for a mass medium, or for the CIA? You are asking me questions that colleagues from other agencies ought to be asking. These are Russia's plans in case the situation develops according to one scenario, a second, or a third. We have our own ideas of what we will do, and how, if the situation develops either with the use of weapons or without their use. We have our own plans, but it is still too early to speak of this. |
| Д.Данишевски: Хорошо. Теперь всё‑таки хотел бы задать вопрос относительно визита Президента Обамы. На самом деле сегодня мы должны были обсуждать результат саммита, который должен был начаться сегодня, я имею в виду саммит с Президентом Обамой. Разочарованы ли Вы отменой этого визита? |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: Okay. Now I would still like to ask a question regarding President Obama's visit. In fact, today we were supposed to discuss the result of the summit that was supposed to start today, I mean the summit with President Obama. Are you disappointed by the cancellation of this visit? |
| Matching Russian passage has not been identified |
Cached English source — passage alignment not verified John Daniszewski: I think when you were running for your third term you said something like the State Department was instigating unrest in Russia trying to weaken a potential rival. Do you really think the US has the secret agenda to undermine your power or undermine Russia? This is in relation to the civil society groups. |
| 7 US-Russia Relations and the Cancelled Obama Visit | |
| В.Путин: Да, конечно. Мне бы хотелось, чтобы Президент Соединённых Штатов посетил Москву, чтобы у нас была с ним возможность поговорить, пообсуждать накопившиеся вопросы. Но я не вижу в этом и никакой особой катастрофы. Дело в том, что контакты между нашими ведомствами, между министрами, причём между министрами самых различных направлений, они не прекращаются. Совсем недавно состоялся визит в Вашингтон Министра обороны Российской Федерации, Министра иностранных дел. У нас между парламентами контакты. То есть работа идёт, она всё равно не останавливается. Мы понимаем, что в связи с позицией России по некоторым вопросам возникает некоторое раздражение у американской администрации. Но с этим ничего не поделаешь. Я думаю, что на самом деле хорошо бы не раздражаться, а вместе набраться терпения и работать над поиском решений. Мне бы хотелось, чтобы Президент Соединённых Штатов посетил Москву, чтобы у нас была с ним возможность поговорить, пообсуждать накопившиеся вопросы. Мы понимаем, что в связи с позицией России по некоторым вопросам возникает некоторое раздражение у американской администрации. На самом деле хорошо бы не раздражаться, а вместе набраться терпения и работать над поиском решений. Я очень рассчитываю на то, что удастся на полях саммита «двадцатки» в Петербурге с моим американским коллегой переговорить. У нас все предыдущие встречи были очень конструктивными. Президент Обама – очень интересный собеседник и человек конкретный, деловой. Уверен, что если встреча произойдёт даже в рамках работы, в ходе «двадцатки», на полях саммита, то она сама по себе уже будет полезной. Но в любом случае у нас очень много вопросов, которыми мы занимались, в решении которых мы заинтересованы. Это и разоруженческая повестка; это те же вопросы, связанные с развитием мировой экономики; это вопросы, связанные с Северной Кореей, с иранской проблематикой. И много других тем и проблем, в решении которых заинтересованы как Соединённые Штаты, так и Россия. Скажем, та же самая проблема борьбы с терроризмом. Совсем недавно американцы пережили трагедию, я имею в виду взрывы во время спортивных соревнований. И наши правоохранительные органы, специальные службы очень активно сотрудничали друг с другом, и сотрудничать продолжают. И это сотрудничество находится явно и в интересах американского народа, и в интересах российского народа. Это сотрудничество не прекращалось, и, я уверен, оно будет развиваться. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: Yes, of course. I would like the President of the United States to visit Moscow, so that we would have the possibility of talking with him, of discussing the questions that have accumulated. But I see no particular catastrophe in this either. The point is that contacts between our agencies, between ministers, and between ministers of the most various directions, do not cease. Quite recently there was a visit to Washington by the Minister of Defense of the Russian Federation and the Minister of Foreign Affairs. We have contacts between the parliaments. That is, the work is going on; it does not stop all the same. We understand that, in connection with Russia's position on some questions, a certain irritation arises in the American administration. But there is nothing to be done about this. I think that in fact it would be good not to be irritated, but together to summon patience and work on the search for solutions. I would like the President of the United States to visit Moscow, so that we would have the possibility of talking with him, of discussing the questions that have accumulated. We understand that, in connection with Russia's position on some questions, a certain irritation arises in the American administration. In fact it would be good not to be irritated, but together to summon patience and work on the search for solutions. I count very much on its being possible to talk with my American colleague on the margins of the summit of the Twenty in St. Petersburg. All our previous meetings were very constructive. President Obama is a very interesting interlocutor and a concrete, businesslike person. I am sure that if a meeting takes place even within the framework of the work, in the course of the Twenty, on the margins of the summit, then it will already be useful in itself. But in any case we have a great many questions with which we have been occupied, in the solution of which we are interested. This is the disarmament agenda too; these are the same questions connected with the development of the world economy; these are questions connected with North Korea, with the Iranian problematic. And many other themes and problems in the solution of which both the United States and Russia are interested. Say, that same problem of the fight against terrorism. Quite recently the Americans lived through a tragedy; I mean the explosions during the sports competitions. And our law-enforcement bodies and special services cooperated very actively with each other, and continue to cooperate. And this cooperation is plainly in the interests of the American people and in the interests of the Russian people. This cooperation has not ceased, and I am sure it will develop. |
| Д.Данишевски: Некоторые говорят о ваших личных взаимоотношениях с Президентом Обамой, о ваших сложившихся тёплых взаимоотношениях. Многие комментируют Ваш язык жестов, который часто говорит о том, что Вы скучаете во время переговоров с ним. Какова Ваша реакция на эти комментарии? Правдивы ли они, что Вы думаете? |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: Some people talk about your personal relations with President Obama, about your established warm relations. Many comment on your body language, which often says that you miss him during negotiations with him. What is your reaction to these comments? Are they true, that you think? |
| Matching Russian passage has not been identified |
Cached English source — passage alignment not verified John Daniszewski: I’m sorry. It may have been a translation error. I didn’t say ‘arrest.’ I said that you were recorded as saying that you thought that the US State Department had an agenda to instigate unrest in Russia to try to weaken its potential rival. Not ‘arrest’ but ‘unrest’. |
| В.Путин: Я думаю, что каждый на своём месте – я имею в виду и тех, кто занимается политикой, экономикой, безопасностью, занимается распространением информации, – каждый старается показать свои наилучшие качества, в том числе и вот те наблюдатели, о которых Вы говорите. Я с удивлением иногда читаю про язык жестов, про то, что мы скучаем или как‑то по‑другому себя ведём. Кто может сказать, кроме нас самих, что у нас в голове и в душе? Есть некоторые жесты, которые, конечно, считываются однозначно, но таких жестов ни с моей стороны в адрес Обамы, ни со стороны Обамы в мой адрес никто никогда не видел, и, я надеюсь, никогда этого не будет. А всё остальное – это выдумки. Повторяю ещё раз, я уже об этом сказал: у нас всегда беседы носят очень конструктивный характер, очень предметный и достаточно откровенный. В этом смысле Президент Соединённых Штатов – очень хороший собеседник, с ним легко разговаривать, потому что понятно, что человек хочет, понятна его позиция, он выслушивает позицию другого собеседника, оппонента, реагирует на неё. Мне с ним интересно работать. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: I think that each in his place — I mean both those occupied with politics, the economy, and security, and those occupied with spreading information — each tries to show his best qualities, including the observers you are speaking of. I sometimes read with surprise about the language of gestures, about our being bored, or about our behaving in some other way. Who, apart from ourselves, can say what is in our heads and in our souls? There are some gestures that of course are read in only one way, but no one has ever seen such gestures either from me toward Obama or from Obama toward me, and I hope this will never be. And everything else is invention. I repeat once more what I have already said: our talks are always of a very constructive character, very much to the point, and fairly frank. In that sense the President of the United States is a very good person to talk with; it is easy to talk with him, because it is clear what the man wants, his position is clear, he hears out the position of the other person he is talking with, of his opponent, and he reacts to it. I find it interesting to work with him. |
| Д.Данишевски: Думаете ли Вы, что мы ещё переживаем последствия «холодной войны» во взаимоотношениях между Россией и Америкой? И как возможно это преодолеть? |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: Do you think that we are still experiencing the consequences of the Cold War in relations between Russia and America? And how is it possible to overcome this? |
| Matching Russian passage has not been identified |
Cached English source — passage alignment not verified John Daniszewski: And the intelligence cooperation you mentioned, is that going on at the same level in spite of the various irritancies in relationship right now? ”The success of Russia as a state will essentially depend on how efficiently the people in municipal and regional entities will work. And if those people are inefficient, if they turn out to be those who try to gain power through some crafty schemes, it is certainly only going to damage the country as a whole.“ |
| В.Путин: Отчасти это так. Но это прежде всего касается, знаете, такого, я бы сказал, среднего уровня взаимодействия практически во всех средах и сферах. Многие люди, особенно в силовых структурах, десятилетиями работавшие в США против Советского Союза, а в Советском Союзе против США, как‑то ещё остаются в той системе отсчёта и в той жизни. Но мне бы очень хотелось думать, что на высшем политическом уровне это не отражается. А сегодняшние наши споры проистекают даже не из этого, они проистекают из разного понимания, наверное, проблем, перед которыми мы стоим, из разного предпочтения средств для достижения общих, повторю, общих целей, ну и умения или неумения искать компромиссы и уважать мнение своих партнёров. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: In part this is so. But it concerns above all, you know, what I would call the middle level of interaction, in practically every milieu and sphere. Many people, especially in the security structures, who worked for decades in the United States against the Soviet Union, and in the Soviet Union against the United States, somehow still remain in that frame of reference and in that life. But I would very much like to think that at the highest political level this is not reflected. And our disputes today do not even stem from this; they stem from a different understanding, probably, of the problems we face, from a different preference among the means for achieving common — I repeat, common — goals, and from the ability or inability to seek compromises and to respect the opinion of one's partners. |
| Д.Данишевски: Когда Вы баллотировались вновь на должность Президента, многие говорили, что аресты, которые проходили, преследовали цель ослабить противника. Думаете ли Вы, что американцы имеют отношение к последним событиям, которые происходят и разворачиваются в гражданском обществе? Президент Соединённых Штатов – очень хороший собеседник, с ним легко разговаривать, потому что понятно, что человек хочет, понятна его позиция, он выслушивает позицию другого собеседника, оппонента, реагирует на неё. Мне с ним интересно работать. |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: When you ran for President again, many said that the arrests that were taking place were aimed at weakening the opponent. Do you think Americans have a hand in the recent events that are happening and unfolding in civil society? The President of the United States is a very good conversationalist, easy to talk to, because it is clear what the person wants, his position is clear, he listens to the position of the other interlocutor, the opponent, and reacts to it. It is interesting for me to work with him. |
| Matching Russian passage has not been identified |
Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Kirill Kleymenov: Mr President, to sum up this discussion concerning Russia-US relations, how would you describe them today? You know, the agenda for President Obama’s visit to Russia was announced today: right after the arrival he is meeting human rights activists and representatives of sexual minorities. And comments have already been made… |
| В.Путин: Я не очень понял, о каких арестах Вы говорите, которые могли бы повлиять на ход избирательной кампании в России. Это какие такие аресты были в России, которые могли повлиять на ход избирательной кампании? Если бы Вы мне пояснили, я бы был Вам очень благодарен. Я не знаю никакого такого ареста, который повлиял бы на ход избирательной кампании в России, не было таких арестов. Или если кого‑то за что‑то наши правоохранительные органы привлекали, то в таких ситуациях, как правило, очень хороший способ защиты – кричать: «Караул! Это политическое дело!». Я таких что‑то даже не знаю. Вы о чём говорите‑то? |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: I did not quite understand what arrests you are talking about that could have influenced the course of the election campaign in Russia. What arrests were these in Russia that could have influenced the course of the election campaign? If you would explain this to me, I would be very grateful to you. I know of no such arrest that would have influenced the course of the election campaign in Russia; there were no such arrests. Or if our law-enforcement bodies charged someone with something, then in such situations, as a rule, a very good means of defense is to shout: "Help! This is a political case!" I do not even know of any such. What is it you are talking about? |
| 8 Cold War Legacy and US Interference | |
| Д.Данишевски: Я думаю, что часто считают, что госдепартамент США заинтересован в том, чтобы ослабить своего соперника и породить неспокойность в России. |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: I think that often it is believed that the US Department of State is interested in weakening its rival and creating unrest in Russia. |
| В.Путин: Иногда у нас такая мысль возникает, говорю Вам откровенно, я и своим американским коллегам говорил. Не знаю, хорошо ли об этом говорить в средствах массовой информации, но в принципе это и так понятно, поэтому я скажу. Я с трудом себе представляю, чтобы посол Российской Федерации в Вашингтоне активно работал с представителями движения «Occupy Wall Street». Я просто не могу себе такого представить, потому что роль посла заключается в том, чтобы наладить межгосударственные связи. Это тонкая работа. При всей совокупности сложных проблем должен быть человек или люди с обеих сторон, которые умеют обходить острые углы, ищут компромиссы, добиваются договорённостей. Ну а как мы видели, сотрудники вашего посольства вели себя именно в таком направлении, это всё равно что мы бы работали, повторяю, с представителями «Occupy Wall Street». Мы этого не делаем, но некоторые сотрудники посольства США считают, что это нормально. Я думаю, что это не соответствует дипломатической практике. Но мы не стали по этому поводу раздувать какую‑то истерику, мы так посмотрели со стороны: ну что, если так, такая манера, ну ладно. Но это не привело к каким‑то негативным последствиям в наших отношениях. Я думаю, что эта практика неправильная и вредная, но таков, видимо, стиль у некоторых руководителей соответствующего ведомства. Люди приходят, люди уходят, а интересы таких огромных государств, как Россия и Соединённые Штаты, остаются, и надо работать. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: Sometimes such a thought arises with us; I tell you frankly, and I have told my American colleagues. I do not know whether it is good to speak of this in the mass media, but in principle it is clear anyway, so I will say it. I have difficulty imagining the ambassador of the Russian Federation in Washington actively working with representatives of the Occupy Wall Street movement. I simply cannot imagine such a thing, because the role of an ambassador consists in arranging interstate ties. This is delicate work. For all the aggregate of complicated problems, there must be a person, or people, on both sides who know how to go around sharp corners, seek compromises, and reach understandings. Well, and as we saw, staff of your embassy conducted themselves precisely in that direction; it is the same as if we were working, I repeat, with representatives of Occupy Wall Street. We do not do this, but some staff of the US embassy consider that this is normal. I think this does not correspond to diplomatic practice. But we did not start inflating some hysteria about it; we looked on from the side: well, if so, if that is the manner, well, all right. But this did not lead to any negative consequences in our relations. I think this practice is wrong and harmful, but such, apparently, is the style of some heads of the corresponding department. People come, people go, and the interests of such enormous states as Russia and the United States remain, and one must work. |
| Д.Данишевски: А сотрудничество между разведывательными службами, как Вы говорили, – развивается ли оно на том же уровне, несмотря на некоторую раздражённость в отношениях? |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: And cooperation between intelligence services, as you said – is it developing at the same level, despite some irritation in relations? |
| В.Путин: Нет, на уровне специальных служб, там тоже бывают сбои, конечно, когда мы передаём какую‑то информацию, а нам говорят: ну ладно, сами, без вас разберёмся; наши говорят: ну ладно, тогда не надо, – но в целом сотрудничество развивается успешно, оно полезно. Я уверен, что эта работа позволяет нам сохранять жизни наших граждан, это самое главное, самый главный результат совместной работы на этом направлении. Я ещё раз хочу выразить надежду на то, что нам удастся и дальше углублять и развивать это сотрудничество. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: No; at the level of the special services there are failures too, of course, when we pass on some piece of information and are told: well, all right, we will sort it out ourselves, without you; and ours say: well, all right, then there is no need — but on the whole the cooperation is developing successfully, and it is useful. I am sure this work lets us preserve the lives of our citizens; that is the main thing, the chief result of joint work in this area. I want once again to express the hope that we will succeed in deepening and developing this cooperation further. |
| К.Клеймёнов: Владимир Владимирович, если подытожить этот разговор о российско-американских отношениях, как бы Вы охарактеризовали эти отношения на нынешнем этапе? Вы знаете, сегодня было объявлено о программе Президента Обамы в России: сразу после прилёта он встречается с правозащитниками и представителями сексуальных меньшинств. И уже прозвучали комментарии: это некий знак уровня наших сегодняшних отношений. Оттого, насколько эффективно будут люди работать в муниципалитетах, в регионах, в значительной степени будет зависеть общий успех России как государства. А если это будут люди неэффективные и такие, которые с помощью каких‑то манипуляций к власти пробираются, то это, безусловно, нанесёт только ущерб стране в целом. |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: Vladimir Vladimirovich, if we summarize this conversation about Russian-American relations, how would you characterize these relations at the current stage? You know, today it was announced about President Obama's program in Russia: immediately after landing he meets with human rights defenders and representatives of sexual minorities. And comments have already been made: this is some sign of the level of our current relations. From how effectively people will work in municipalities, in regions, to a large extent will depend on the overall success of Russia as a state. And if these will be ineffective people and such who get to power with the help of some manipulations, then this will undoubtedly cause harm to the country as a whole. |
| Matching Russian passage has not been identified |
Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Kirill Kleymenov: September is not only the time when the summit takes place but also the beginning of Russia’s political season. The election is on the way. On September 8, many regions will be electing their leaders and heads of legislative assemblies. As usual, a lot of opinion polls have been conducted prior to the voting day. You know, some of them have uncovered quite unpleasant facts. Quite a lot of people doubt that the election is going to be fair. You cannot help feeling upset by this fact, can you? |
| В.Путин: Это практика американской дипломатии – показывать поддержку гражданского общества. Я здесь не вижу ничего плохого. Наоборот, мы это приветствуем. Чтобы был полный срез и понимание того, что происходит в нашем обществе. Очень хорошо, конечно, было бы, если бы дипломатическая служба, посольство, специальные службы, они для этого и существуют, давали полную, именно полную и объективную картину состояния российского общества, а не только с одного угла бы смотрели. Хотя это тоже важная вещь, важный взгляд на то, как организованы и как себя чувствуют люди, которые занимаются вопросами защиты прав человека. И всё‑таки, если определить эти отношения: была перезагрузка, сейчас это заморозка, похолодание? |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: It is the practice of American diplomacy to show support for civil society. I see nothing bad in this. On the contrary, we welcome it. So that there is a full cross-section and an understanding of what is happening in our society. It would of course be very good if the diplomatic service, the embassy, the special services — they exist for this — gave a full picture, precisely a full and objective picture, of the state of Russian society, and did not look from only one angle. Although this too is an important thing, an important view of how people who concern themselves with the defense of human rights are organized and how they feel. And still, if one is to define these relations: there was a reset; is this now a freeze, a cold spell? |
| В.Путин: Нет, это просто текущая работа, отстаивание своих интересов, своих принципов решения международных и двусторонних вопросов. Это непростая, напряжённая совместная работа. Да, она не покрыта розами, цветами. Это сложная работа, и подчас она трудна, и ничего здесь особенного нет. Но ни Президент Обама не избирался американским народом для того, чтобы быть приятным для России, ни Ваш покорный слуга был избран народом России не для того, чтобы быть приятным для кого‑то. Мы работаем, спорим в чём‑то, мы люди, иногда кто‑то раздражается. Но, повторяю ещё раз, глобальные взаимные интересы, мне кажется, всё‑таки являются хорошим фундаментом для поиска совместных решений. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: No, this is simply current work, the defense of one's interests and of one's principles for settling international and bilateral questions. It is difficult, tense joint work. Yes, it is not strewn with roses and flowers. This work is hard, and at times it is difficult, and there is nothing special in that. But neither was President Obama elected by the American people in order to be agreeable to Russia, nor was your humble servant elected by the people of Russia in order to be agreeable to someone. We work, we argue about some things; we are people, and sometimes someone gets irritated. But, I repeat once more, global mutual interests are, it seems to me, a good foundation all the same for the search for joint decisions. |
| К.Клеймёнов: Сентябрь – это ещё и начало политического сезона в России, это не только время саммита. У нас совсем скоро выборы. 8 сентября во многих регионах будут выбирать глав регионов и законодательных собраний. Как обычно, в преддверии голосования было проведено много достаточно опросов общественного мнения. Вы знаете, некоторые опросы показали довольно неприятные вещи. Достаточно много людей не верит, что выборы будут честными. Вас такие результаты не могут не удручать. |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: September is also the beginning of the political season in Russia; it is not only the time of the summit. We have elections very soon. 8 September, heads of regions and legislative assemblies will be elected in many regions. As usual, many public opinion polls were conducted in anticipation of the vote. You know, some polls showed rather unpleasant things. A fairly large number of people do not believe that the elections will be fair. Such results cannot but dishearten you. |
| В.Путин: У нас вообще с трудом верят во что‑нибудь, это в принципе нормально, люди всегда должны сомневаться. Дело власти всё‑таки стремиться к идеальному результату, хотя идеальных результатов не бывает, наверное, никогда. Но всё‑таки обязанность власти, дело чести каждого чиновника на местах, избирательных комиссий, правоохранительных органов наладить дело должным образом, так, чтобы люди могли действительно объективно выразить своё отношение к тем или другим кандидатам, а волеизъявление людей привело бы к формированию эффективных и дееспособных органов власти. Мы в этом в высшей степени заинтересованы, в крайней степени заинтересованы. Потому что оттого, насколько эффективно будут люди работать в муниципалитетах, в регионах, в значительной степени будет зависеть общий успех России как государства. А если это будут люди неэффективные и такие, которые с помощью каких‑то манипуляций к власти пробираются, то это, безусловно, нанесёт только ущерб стране в целом. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: In general people here believe in anything only with difficulty; this is normal in principle, people must always have doubts. It is the business of authority all the same to strive for an ideal result, although ideal results probably never occur. But all the same it is the duty of authority, a point of honor for every official on the ground, for the election commissions, for the law-enforcement bodies, to arrange the matter properly, so that people can really express in an objective way their attitude to one candidate or another, and so that the people's act of will leads to the formation of effective and capable bodies of authority. We are interested in this to the highest degree, interested to the utmost degree. Because the general success of Russia as a state will depend, to a significant degree, on how effectively people work in the municipalities and in the regions. And if these are ineffective people, and people of the sort who make their way to power by means of some manipulations, then this will of course only do harm to the country as a whole. |
| К.Клеймёнов: Вы знаете, я в продолжение темы объективности и справедливости хочу спросить о судебной системе, вернее, о некоторых решениях, которые эта система рождает на свет. Вот некий, конкретный, правда, пример: чиновник средней руки в суде получил несколько лет условно за доказанное хищение 400 примерно миллионов рублей – и одновременно с этим сельский учитель, который по совместительству управляет местным клубом, за взятку размером 400 тысяч рублей получает семь лет строгого режима и 3 миллиона рублей компенсации, штрафа. Он, если я не ошибаюсь, многодетный отец. Вы знаете, ну я даже не спрашиваю о логике этих решений. Я, конечно, понимаю, что Вы не можете сказать, что судебное решение было там несправедливым. Но складывается впечатление, что подобное положение вещей, конечно, невозможно терпеть, систему необходимо менять, это нонсенс какой‑то. Мы не можем оценить – совершил Сноуден какое‑то преступление в США или нет. Но мы, как суверенная страна, не имея соглашений с Соединёнными Штатами [о взаимной выдаче преступников], не можем поступить иначе, кроме как предоставить ему возможность здесь проживать. |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: You know, continuing the theme of objectivity and fairness, I want to ask about the judicial system, rather, about some decisions that this system brings to light. Here is a specific, though true, example: a mid-level official in the court received several years of probation for proven embezzlement of 400 approximately million rubles – and at the same time a rural teacher, who also manages a local club, for a bribe of 400 thousand rubles receives seven years of strict regime and 3 million rubles in compensation, a fine. He, if I am not mistaken, is a father of many children. You know, well, I don't even ask about the logic of these decisions. I, of course, understand that you cannot say that the court decision was unfair there. But it seems that such a situation, of course, cannot be endured, the system must be changed, it is some kind of nonsense. We cannot assess whether Snowden committed some crime in the United States or not. But we, as a sovereign country, without agreements with the United States [on the extradition of criminals], cannot do anything other than provide him the opportunity to live here. |
| В.Путин: Вы знаете, внешне вроде бы почти одно и то же, а в соответствии с логикой законодателя всё‑таки преступления имеют разную общественную опасность. Например, ущерб для потерпевшего может быть одним и тем же, скажем, миллион рублей. У кого‑то украли миллион рублей, а кого‑то ограбили на миллион рублей, только грабёж – это более общественно опасное преступление, совершенное с большей дерзостью. Несмотря на то что ущерб одинаковый для потерпевшего, всё‑таки наказание для грабителя, оно, как правило, больше, чем для того, кто совершил изъятие в данном случае материальных или денежных средств в объёме один миллион тайным образом. Когда вор крадёт, он исходит из того, что потерпевший не видит, что он делает, а грабитель знает заранее, что жертва видит всё, понимает, и он тем не менее дерзко совершает такое преступление. Ущерб одинаковый, а наказание может быть разным, и это, кстати говоря, обоснованно. Тот пример, который вы привели, он, конечно, не укладывается полностью в приведённый мною. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: You know, outwardly it looks almost one and the same, but according to the logic of the legislator, crimes all the same have a different danger to society. For example, the loss to the victim may be one and the same, say a million rubles. A million rubles was stolen from someone, and someone was robbed of a million rubles; only robbery is a crime more dangerous to society, committed with greater boldness. Despite the loss being the same for the victim, the punishment for the robber is all the same, as a rule, greater than for the one who in this case took material means or money in the amount of one million, in secret. When a thief steals, he proceeds from the view that the victim does not see what he is doing, whereas the robber knows beforehand that the victim sees everything and understands, and he nevertheless boldly commits such a crime. The loss is the same, and the punishment may be different, and this, by the way, is justified. The example you gave does not, of course, fit entirely into the one I have set out. |
| К.Клеймёнов: Да, это пример с конкретной фамилией. |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: Yes, this is an example with a specific surname. |
| Matching Russian passage has not been identified |
Cached English source — passage alignment not verified John Daniszewski: Since we are talking about legal matters, the Edward Snowden case has aroused a lot of unhappiness and frustration. What do you as a former security man think about the actions of a man like Snowden who leaks secret information he was entrusted with? |
| 10 The Russian Judicial System | |
| В.Путин: Да, но я сейчас говорю о том, что внешне может быть одно и то же, а по существу, по мысли законодателя это всё‑таки разные преступления. Данный случай, конечно, вопиющий. Существуют определённые санкции, в рамках этих санкций судья сам выбирает определённое решение по совету со своими коллегами, конечно. Могут быть и разные оценки этой общественной опасности. Взятка – это более общественно опасное преступление, чем просто кража, понимаете? Это очевидная вещь. Но могут быть и ошибки. Вот в Соединённых Штатах, например, применяется смертная казнь. Везде, в странах, где применяется смертная казнь, и у нас так было, бывают случаи, и они не единичный характер носят, когда после уже исполнения смертной казни выясняется, что человек не виноват. Вот что по этому поводу скажешь? Что, закрыть все суды, что ли? Нет, надо совершенствовать судебную систему, совершенствовать законодательство, делать его более прозрачным, адекватным сегодняшнему дню и тем общественным отношениям, которые регулирует тот или иной закон. Это вопросы совершенствования судебной системы. Но это не вопрос того, что она никуда не годна, её нужно всю переломать. Это не так, российская судебная система имеет свои глубокие корни. Российская судебная система – это неотъемлемая часть международной, мировой судебной системы. Наше право, оно имеет огромные исторические корни, оно является частью континентального права Европы, и очень многие принципы организации нашего права, правоприменительная практика ни в чём не уступают, а по некоторым параметрам даже лучше, чем законы и правоприменительная практика в других государствах. Да, есть проблемы, их много, с ними надо работать. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: Yes, but I am speaking now of the fact that outwardly it may be one and the same thing, while in essence, in the legislator's intent, these are all the same different crimes. This case is, of course, flagrant. Certain sanctions exist; within the framework of these sanctions the judge himself chooses a certain decision, on the advice of his colleagues, of course. There can also be different assessments of this social danger. A bribe is a more socially dangerous crime than simple theft, do you understand? This is an obvious thing. But there can also be mistakes. In the United States, for example, the death penalty is applied. Everywhere, in countries where the death penalty is applied, and it was so with us too, there are cases, and they are not of an isolated character, when after the death penalty has already been carried out it turns out that the person was not guilty. What can one say about this? What, close all the courts, then? No, one must improve the judicial system, improve the legislation, make it more transparent, adequate to the present day and to the social relations that this or that law regulates. These are questions of improving the judicial system. But this is not a question of its being good for nothing and of its needing to be broken up entirely. That is not so; the Russian judicial system has its deep roots. The Russian judicial system is an inalienable part of the international, the world judicial system. Our law has enormous historical roots; it is part of the continental law of Europe, and very many principles of the organization of our law, and law-enforcement practice, are in no way inferior, and by some parameters even better, than the laws and law-enforcement practice in other states. Yes, there are problems, there are many of them, and one must work on them. |
| К.Клеймёнов: По‑вашему, суд в России можно назвать независимым? |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: In your opinion, can the court in Russia be called independent? |
| В.Путин: Суд в России, конечно, является независимым. Там, где судья не хочет быть независимым, там нет независимости, там он может и к губернатору забежать, и с тем посоветоваться, и с этим посоветоваться. Но, я Вас уверяю, так почти везде. А в целом, если судья занимает принципиальную позицию, с ним никто ничего не может сделать. В сегодняшних условиях современной России, я думаю, что никому и не захочется, потому что у него очень большие властные и процессуальные права. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: The court in Russia is, of course, independent. Where a judge does not want to be independent, there is no independence; there he may drop in on the governor, and consult with this person, and consult with that one. But I assure you, it is like that almost everywhere. And on the whole, if a judge takes a principled stand, no one can do anything to him. In the present conditions of today's Russia, I think that no one will even want to, because he has very extensive powers and procedural rights. |
| Д.Данишевски: Поскольку мы говорим о юридических вопросах, дело Эдварда Сноудена вызвало некоторое недовольство и разочарование в США. Вы, как бывший человек из специальных служб, как Вы бы отреагировали на поведение таких людей, как Сноуден, который допустил утечку секретной информации? |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: Since we are talking about legal issues, the Edward Snowden case has caused some dissatisfaction and disappointment in the United States. You, as a former intelligence officer, how would you react to the behavior of people like Snowden, who leaked classified information? |
| Matching Russian passage has not been identified |
Cached English source — passage alignment not verified John Daniszewski: Has Edward Snowden offered Russia any information, any confidential information and if he did, would you say what? No, he didn’t offer us any information. We didn’t receive anything from him and we do not intend to. We are professionals as well, and we believe that everything he could tell us is already known to our US colleagues from special services. They have minimised all possible risks in this regard, they have altered, destroyed, changed everything. He is of no use to us. We did not even want to get involved into all this, you see. He is a man of a completely different type; of course he can be presented as anyone. I understand that US special services are interested in portraying him as a traitor, but he sees things differently – he calls himself a fighter for human rights. He may well be denied this characteristic but that is already the business of those who make judgments. He calls himself like this and behaves just like this. We have no desire to involve him in any kind of cooperation or get any information from him. He has never tried to give us anything, and we have never tried to get anything out of him. |
| Matching Russian passage has not been identified | John Daniszewski: So, theoretically, he could live to a ripe old age in Russia? |
| В.Путин: Если это была действительно секретная информация и если такой человек нанёс бы нам какой‑то ущерб, то, безусловно, я стремился бы к тому, чтобы он ответил по всей строгости российского закона. Дальний Восток столкнулся с небывалым бедствием. Такого наводнения старожилы не припомнят. Я на вертолёте когда летел, такое впечатление, что летишь над морем. Единственное, что сразу возвращает на грешную землю, это то, что из этого моря крыши торчат. Сразу понимаешь весь ужас того, что происходит. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: If this really was secret information, and if such a person had done us some damage, then of course I would have sought to have him answer to the full severity of Russian law. The Far East has met with an unprecedented disaster. Old-timers recall no such flood. When I was flying in a helicopter, the impression was that one is flying over the sea. The only thing that at once returns one to this sinful earth is that roofs stick up out of this sea. One at once understands the full horror of what is happening. |
| Д.Данишевски: И в этой связи думаете ли Вы, что администрация США права, что просит его выдачи из России и просит Вас отослать его обратно? |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: And in this connection, do you think the United States administration is right to request his extradition from Russia and ask you to send him back? |
| Matching Russian passage has not been identified |
Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Kirill Kleymenov: Mr President, if you allow me, a couple of questions on economy. When meeting with students during your recent visit to Vladivostok you said that the government will cut the planned expenditure. And here a forgotten word ”sequester“ comes to mind. But first of all, is it this year's or next year's budget that we are talking about? And what is the scale of these reductions? |
| 9 The Snowden Case | |
| В.Путин: Возможно, что да. Видите, проблема заключается совершенно не в этом. Проблема заключается в том, что мы не знаем, права администрация или не права. И проблема заключается не в том, что мы защищаем Сноудена. Мы совсем его не защищаем. Проблема в том, что у нас нет с Соединёнными Штатами соглашения о взаимной выдаче преступников. Мы Соединённым Штатам многократно предлагали заключить такое соглашение и получили отказ. В мире существуют определённые правила и процедуры, согласно которым преступник может и должен быть выдан другой стороне, если есть соответствующее соглашение, в котором многие вещи прописаны и определённые гарантии даны. Но США отказались с нами подписывать такое соглашение. А наших преступников, которые не какие‑то секреты выдали, а у которых руки по локоть в крови, которые людей убивали, которые торговали людьми, и наши коллеги американские знают об этом, нам не выдают. Мы не можем оценить – совершил Сноуден какое‑то преступление в США или нет. Мы просто не в состоянии этого сделать. Но мы, как суверенная страна, не имея таких соглашений с Соединёнными Штатами, не можем поступить иначе, кроме как предоставить ему возможность здесь проживать. Вот я вам сейчас прямо скажу то, чего никогда не говорил, – намекал, но впрямую не говорил. Господин Сноуден впервые появился в Гонконге, встретился с нашими дипломатическими представителями. Мне доложили, что есть такой сотрудник, сотрудник спецслужб. Я их спросил: «А что ему надо?» – «Он борется за права человека, за свободу распространения информации, борется с нарушениями прав человека в этой сфере и с нарушениями законодательства в самих Соединённых Штатах и с нарушением норм международного права». Я говорю: «Ну и что? Если он хочет остаться у нас, пожалуйста, может оставаться, но только в этом случае он должен прекратить всякую деятельность, которая бы разрушала российско-американские отношения. Мы не НПО, у нас есть государственные интересы, и мы не хотим разрушать российско-американские связи». Ему об этом сказали. Он сказал: «Нет, я борец за права человека, я призываю вас бороться вместе со мной». Я сказал: «Нет, мы с ним бороться не будем, пускай сам борется». И он ушёл, просто ушёл, и всё. Потом он начал перелетать в Латинскую Америку на самолёте. Мне о том, что к нам летит господин Сноуден, сказали за два часа до посадки самолёта. Что произошло дальше? Произошла утечка. Представители американских спецслужб, я думаю, пусть они на меня не сердятся, могли бы действовать и более профессионально, и дипломаты, кстати, тоже. После того как узнали, что он летит к нам и что он летит транзитом, оказали давление на все страны, куда он мог бы добраться, на все латиноамериканские страны, на европейские. Вместо того чтобы он выехал в какую‑то страну с лёгким оперативным режимом, либо, может быть, по дороге могли бы его перехватить, – так они, кстати, сделали с посадкой самолёта Президента одной из латиноамериканских стран, что, кстати, совершенно недопустимо, на мой взгляд, грубо и недостойно ни самих Соединённых Штатов, ни Ваших европейских партнёров. Это просто унизительно. В отношении Сноудена могли бы это сделать. Что мешало‑то? Нет, всех напугали, он автоматом остался у нас в аэропорту, засел здесь, у нас. И что мы должны после этого делать? Отдать его туда? Заключайте тогда с нами соглашение. Не хотите – не надо. Отдавайте наших бандитов. Не хотите – не надо. А почему же вы требуете от нас выдачи в одностороннем порядке? Что это за снобизм такой? Надо учитывать интересы друг друга, надо работать и искать профессиональные решения. Поэтому мы не Сноудена защищаем, мы защищаем определённые нормы взаимоотношений между государствами. Я очень рассчитываю на то, что в будущем мы выйдем с Соединёнными Штатами на соответствующие договорённости и сможем закрепить их в документах, в правовых и обязывающих. У нас нет законов, направленных против лиц нетрадиционной сексуальной ориентации. В России принят закон о запрете пропаганды нетрадиционной сексуальной ориентации среди несовершеннолетних, это совершенно разные вещи. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: Perhaps yes. You see, the problem consists in something completely different. The problem consists in our not knowing whether the administration is right or not right. And the problem does not consist in our defending Snowden. We are not defending him at all. The problem is that we have no agreement with the United States on the mutual extradition of criminals. We repeatedly proposed to the United States that such an agreement be concluded, and received a refusal. In the world there exist definite rules and procedures according to which a criminal can and must be extradited to the other side if there is a corresponding agreement in which many things are written down and definite guarantees are given. But the United States refused to sign such an agreement with us. And our criminals, who did not give away some secrets but whose hands are in blood up to the elbow, who killed people, who traded in people, and our American colleagues know of this, are not extradited to us. We cannot assess whether Snowden committed some crime in the United States or not. We are simply not in a position to do this. But we, as a sovereign country, not having such agreements with the United States, cannot act otherwise than to give him the possibility of residing here. I will tell you straight now what I have never said — I hinted, but I did not say it outright. Mr. Snowden first appeared in Hong Kong and met with our diplomatic representatives. It was reported to me that there is such an employee, an employee of the special services. I asked them: "And what does he want?" — "He is fighting for human rights, for freedom of the dissemination of information, fighting violations of human rights in this sphere and violations of the legislation in the United States themselves and violations of the norms of international law." I say: "Well, and what? If he wants to stay with us, please, he may stay, but only in this case must he cease any activity that would destroy Russian-American relations. We are not an NGO; we have state interests, and we do not want to destroy Russian-American ties." He was told this. He said: "No, I am a fighter for human rights; I call on you to fight together with me." I said: "No, we will not fight with him; let him fight himself." And he left, simply left, and that is all. Then he began to fly over to Latin America by plane. I was told that Mr. Snowden was flying to us two hours before the plane landed. What happened further? A leak occurred. Representatives of the American special services, I think — let them not be angry with me — could have acted more professionally, and the diplomats too, by the way. After they learned that he was flying to us and that he was flying in transit, they put pressure on all the countries he might have reached, on all the Latin American countries, on the European ones. Instead of his leaving for some country with a light operational regime, or perhaps of their intercepting him along the way — that is what they did, by the way, with the landing of the plane of the President of one of the Latin American countries, which, by the way, is completely inadmissible, in my view, crude and unworthy either of the United States themselves or of your European partners. It is simply humiliating. In relation to Snowden they could have done this. What was in the way? No, they frightened everyone; he automatically stayed with us at the airport, settled in here, with us. And what are we supposed to do after this? Hand him over there? Then conclude an agreement with us. If you do not want to, there is no need. Hand over our bandits. If you do not want to, there is no need. And why do you demand extradition from us unilaterally? What kind of snobbery is this? One must take each other's interests into account; one must work and seek professional solutions. So we are not defending Snowden; we are defending definite norms of relations between states. I count very much on our coming in the future, with the United States, to the corresponding agreements and being able to fix them in documents, in legal and binding ones. We have no laws directed against persons of nontraditional sexual orientation. In Russia a law has been adopted on the prohibition of propaganda of nontraditional sexual orientation among minors; these are completely different things. |
| Д.Данишевски: А Эдвард Сноуден предложил России какую‑либо секретную информацию или конфиденциальную информацию? |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: And did Edward Snowden offer Russia any classified or confidential information? |
| В.Путин: Нет, он нам ничего не предлагал, мы от него ничего не получали, и у нас желания даже этого нет. Мы исходим из того – мы тоже люди профессиональные, – что всё, что он мог сказать, всё и так известно американским нашим коллегам из спецслужб, они уже купировали все возможные риски для себя в этом плане, всё заменили, уничтожили, поменяли. Какой нам толк от него? Но мы не хотели даже в это ввязываться, понимаете? Он совершенно другой человек, его можно, конечно, подавать как угодно. Я понимаю, что американским спецслужбам выгодно подать его как предателя, но он человек совершенно другого склада ума, он чувствует себя борцом за права человека. Его можно в качестве такого не признавать, но это уже дело тех, кто даёт оценки, но он себя позиционирует именно так и с нами ведёт себя именно так. У нас нет никакого желания привлекать его к какому‑то сотрудничеству, выкачивать из него какую‑то информацию. Он и никогда не пытался нам ничего давать, а мы ничего не пытались из него выуживать. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: No, he offered us nothing, we received nothing from him, and we do not even have the wish for it. We proceed from this — we are professional people too — that everything he could have said is known anyway to our American colleagues in the special services; they have already cut off every possible risk to themselves in this respect, replaced everything, destroyed it, changed it. What use is he to us? But we did not even want to get mixed up in this, do you understand? He is an entirely different man; he can of course be presented however one likes. I understand that it suits the American special services to present him as a traitor, but he is a man of an entirely different cast of mind; he feels himself a fighter for human rights. One may choose not to recognize him in that capacity, but that is already a matter for those who make the assessments; he positions himself precisely so, and with us he conducts himself precisely so. We have no wish whatever to draw him into any cooperation, to pump any information out of him. And he never tried to give us anything, and we never tried to fish anything out of him. |
| Д.Данишевски: То есть теоретически он мог бы дожить до старости в России? |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: That is, theoretically, could he have lived to old age in Russia? |
| В.Путин: Вы знаете, я иногда думал о нём, он странный парень. Молодой человек, ему 30 лет с небольшим. Что он себе думает, я не представляю. Как он собирается строить свою будущую жизнь? В принципе он обрёк себя на достаточно сложную жизнь. Что он будет дальше делать, я даже не представляю. Но понятно уже, что мы его не отдадим, он может себя чувствовать здесь в безопасности. Но дальше‑то что? Может быть, пройдёт какое‑то время, и сама Америка поймёт, что имеет дело не с предателем и шпионом, а имеет дело с человеком, у которого есть определённые убеждения, их можно оценивать по‑разному. И, может быть, будут найдены и в этом случае какие‑то компромиссы. Я не знаю, это его судьба, но он её выбрал и сделал это самостоятельно. Он считает, что это благородно, что это оправданно, и такие жертвы нужны, это его выбор. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: You know, I have sometimes thought about him; he is a strange fellow. A young man, a little over 30. What he thinks to himself, I cannot imagine. How he intends to build his future life, I do not even imagine. In principle he has condemned himself to a fairly hard life. What he will do next, I do not even imagine. But it is already clear that we will not hand him over; he can feel safe here. But what then? Perhaps some time will pass, and America itself will understand that it is dealing not with a traitor and a spy, but with a man who has certain convictions; they can be assessed in different ways. And perhaps in this case too some compromises will be found. I do not know; this is his fate, but he chose it and did so on his own. He considers that this is noble, that this is justified, and that such sacrifices are needed; that is his choice. |
| К.Клеймёнов: Владимир Владимирович, если позволите, несколько вопросов об экономике. Во время недавней поездки во Владивосток на встрече со студентами Вы обмолвились, что Правительству предстоит урезать запланированные расходы. И сразу такое запылённое словечко «секвестр» вспомнилось. Всё‑таки речь идёт, во‑первых, о бюджете текущего года или будущего? И вообще, каков размер этих сокращений? |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: Vladimir Vladimirovich, if you allow me, a few questions about the economy. During your recent trip to Vladivostok at a meeting with students you mentioned that the Government will have to cut planned expenditures. And immediately the dusty word 'sequestration' came to mind. After all, the question is, first of all, about the budget of the current year or the future? And generally, what is the size of these cuts? |
| Matching Russian passage has not been identified |
Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Kirill Kleymenov: I would like to ask you to get back to one more recent story – attack on a police officer at one of Moscow markets. And after this story found great public response, measures were taken at once, as they say in our country, tough decisions, lots of violations were detected. You know, it is a strange thing, why does detecting these violations require your personal attention to this matter and your personal involvement? We feel that in the system of public administration there is a great number of, I don’t know, maybe conformists, maybe timeservers, who are not capable of making decisions independently and act quickly and efficiently. |
| 11 Economy and Budget Restraint | |
| В.Путин: Напомню, что секвестр – это грубое урезание всех расходов без исключения на определённую величину, вне зависимости от приоритетов. Такое иногда случается в экономиках мира и связано это с какими‑то резкими изменениями экономической конъюнктуры и негативными тенденциями в экономике. Такой ситуации у нас сейчас нет, у нас же не минус, а у нас небольшой, но всё‑таки рост по сравнению с прошлым годом. Но проблема в том, что мы предполагали, что рост будет больше, а если рост больше, то доходов бюджета больше. И первоначально мы планировали больше истратить денег на различные программы. Теперь очевидно, что на сегодняшний день прогноз немножко другой, экономика растёт, но медленнее, доходов будет меньше, а значит, и тратить нам нужно будет аккуратнее. Это не секвестр, но нам нужно сделать ещё один прогноз развития экономики и, исходя из этого прогноза, исходя из реалий, наметить и расходы, определив приоритеты. Я думаю, что в чём‑то придётся и сократиться. Но это должно будет предложить само Правительство в ходе работы над бюджетом. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: I will remind you that a sequestration is a crude cutting of all expenditure without exception by a certain amount, irrespective of priorities. This sometimes happens in the world's economies, and it is connected with some sharp change in the economic situation and with negative tendencies in the economy. We have no such situation now; with us it is not a minus, but a small growth all the same by comparison with last year. But the problem is that we supposed the growth would be greater, and if the growth is greater, budget revenue is greater. And at the outset we planned to spend more money on various programs. It is now obvious that as of today the forecast is a little different: the economy is growing, but more slowly, revenue will be less, and so we will have to spend more carefully. This is not a sequestration, but we need to make one further forecast of how the economy will develop and, proceeding from that forecast, proceeding from the realities, to set the expenditure too, having defined the priorities. I think that in something we will also have to cut back. But the Government itself will have to propose this in the course of the work on the budget. |
| К.Клеймёнов: То есть статьи пока не определены? Во время проведения Олимпийских игр, других массовых спортивных мероприятий можно быть абсолютно уверенными в том, что Россия будет строго придерживаться принципов олимпизма, которые не допускают дискриминации людей по какому бы то ни было признаку: по национальному, гендерному либо по признаку сексуальной ориентации. |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: That is, the items are not yet determined? During the Olympic Games, other major sporting events, one can be absolutely sure that Russia will strictly adhere to the principles of Olympism, which do not allow discrimination of people on any ground: national, gender, or sexual orientation. |
| В.Путин: Нет. Понимаете, в чём опасность, если этого не делать? Мы тогда пойдём по пути тех стран, которые забираются в большие дефициты и ведут дело к наращиванию государственного долга. Если мы ничего не сделаем, то в 14‑м году у нас будет один объём дефицита, через год он будет ещё больше, потом ещё больше, и мы попадём в очень сложную ситуацию. Если мы ответственные люди, если мы хотим чувствовать себя уверенно, поскромнее, может быть, на каком‑то этапе жизни, зато уверенно, знать, что ничего не грохнется, ничего не взорвётся и не развалится, тогда мы должны действовать аккуратно и профессионально. Вот о чём идёт речь. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: No. You see what the danger is if this is not done? We will then follow the path of those countries that run up large deficits and lead matters toward a buildup of the state debt. If we do nothing, then in '14 we will have one volume of deficit, a year later it will be still larger, then larger still, and we will find ourselves in a very difficult situation. If we are responsible people, if we want to feel confident — more modestly, perhaps, at some stage of life, but confidently — and to know that nothing will come crashing down, nothing will explode, and nothing will fall apart, then we must act carefully and professionally. That is what this is about. |
| К.Клеймёнов: По поводу «поскромнее». Людям чего ждать? Им надо, на всякий случай так, начинать экономить? Именно на всякий случай. |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: Regarding 'more modest'. What should people expect? Should they, just in case, start saving? Precisely just in case. |
| В.Путин: Нет. Ведь доходы людей растут в целом. Может быть, скромно, и не у всех категорий, но, несмотря на то что темпы роста экономики не такие, как мы ожидали, а доходы растут, тем не менее Правительство должно будет предложить решения и в сфере инвестиционной деятельности, в сфере, может быть, социальной, я не знаю. Это, повторяю ещё раз, сложная, многоплановая работа. Когда она будет закончена, Правительство представит свои предложения. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: No. People's incomes are, after all, growing on the whole. Perhaps modestly, and not in every category, but despite the rates of economic growth not being what we expected, incomes are growing all the same; the Government will nevertheless have to propose decisions both in the sphere of investment activity and, perhaps, in the social sphere; I do not know. This, I repeat once more, is complex, many-sided work. When it is finished, the Government will present its proposals. |
| К.Клеймёнов: Я хотел бы попросить Вас вернуться к ещё одной недавней истории – нападению на московского милиционера на одном из столичных рынков. После того как эта история получила огромный резонанс, были приняты сразу меры, как у нас говорят, в стране, жёсткие решения, было выявлено множество нарушений. Вы знаете, вот удивительное дело, почему для того, чтобы эти нарушения выявить, потребовалось Ваше личное внимание к этой теме, Ваше личное участие? Вообще складывается ощущение, что в системе государственного управления значительное количество, не знаю, может быть, конформистов, может быть, приспособленцев, которые не способны принимать самостоятельные решения и действовать оперативно. |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: I would like to ask you to return to another recent story – the attack on a Moscow policeman at one of the capital's markets. After this story received huge resonance, immediate measures were taken, as we say, in the country, strict decisions were made, many violations were revealed. You know, here is a wonderful thing, why did it require your personal attention to this topic, your personal involvement, to reveal these violations? In general, it seems that in the system of state management a significant number, I don't know, perhaps conformists, perhaps sycophants, who are unable to make independent decisions and act promptly. |
| В.Путин: Я сам об этом думаю. Вот я, знаете, смотрел недавно кадры, когда молодые ребята «бомбят» наркоторговцев, хватают их на улицах и так далее. У меня у самого возникла мысль, ну что этого никто не знает, почему мужики эти должны… |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: I think about this myself. You know, I recently watched footage of young guys "bombing" drug dealers, seizing them on the streets, and so on. I myself had the thought: well, that no one knows about this, why should these men… |
| К.Клеймёнов: Их поливают краской. |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: They are being painted with paint. |
| В.Путин: …да, заниматься этим. Это говорит о том, что где‑то глаз замыливается, где‑то приобретает это такой характер обыденности, где‑то это результат коррумпированности правоохранительных органов. Это совокупность причин. Ну что же, надо просто с этим бороться. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: …yes, to occupy oneself with this. This shows that in some places the eye becomes glazed, in some places this takes on the character of routine, in some places it is the result of corruption in the law-enforcement bodies. It is a combination of causes. Well then, one simply has to fight this. |
| К.Клеймёнов: Но система по‑прежнему на ручном управлении? |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: But the system is still under manual control? |
| 12 Manual Governance and the Far East Floods | |
| В.Путин: В чём‑то – на ручном, в чём‑то – нет, где‑то она функционирует в нормальном, обычном режиме, но когда она даёт сбой, приходится включать ручное управление. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: In some respects it is on manual control, in some respects it is not; in places it functions in a normal, ordinary mode, but when it fails, manual control has to be switched on. |
| К.Клеймёнов: Как на Дальнем Востоке сейчас в этой поездке? |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: How is it on the Far East now on this trip? |
| Matching Russian passage has not been identified |
Cached English source — passage alignment not verified John Daniszewski: Mr President, the Winter Olympics are just six months away, and it looks like everything will be done on time and ready. During the recent World Athletics Championship many eyes were focused on the new Russian law banning gay propaganda. Are you worried that this issue is going to be a flashpoint around the Olympics, the Winter Games? |
| В.Путин: Не совсем. Вот здесь я с Вами не соглашусь, потому что всё‑таки Дальний Восток столкнулся с небывалым бедствием. Такого наводнения вообще старожилы не припомнят, вообще не было никогда, чтобы в Хабаровске так поднялась вода, в Комсомольске-на-Амуре, в Еврейской автономной области. Вы знаете, я на вертолёте когда летел, такое впечатление, что летишь над морем. Единственное, что сразу возвращает на грешную землю, это то, что из этого моря крыши торчат. Сразу понимаешь весь ужас того, что происходит. Масштаб колоссальный, и поэтому я думаю, что здесь вполне обоснованно вмешательство Президента, это нормально. Мы должны сделать всё, для того чтобы не дать террористам ни одного шанса на проявление своей жестокости и человеконенавистнической деятельности и политики. Мы проводим большой комплекс мероприятий, направленных на обеспечение безопасности проведения Олимпийских игр. Исхожу из того, что нашим специальным службам и правоохранительным органам удастся это сделать. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: Not entirely. Here I will not agree with you, because the Far East has all the same met with an unprecedented disaster. Old-timers do not recall any such flood; there has never been a case of the water rising so in Khabarovsk, in Komsomolsk-on-Amur, in the Jewish Autonomous Region. You know, when I was flying by helicopter the impression was that one is flying over the sea. The only thing that at once brings one back to this sinful earth is that roofs stick up out of this sea. One at once understands the whole horror of what is happening. The scale is colossal, and so I think the President's intervention here is fully justified; this is normal. We must do everything so as not to give the terrorists a single chance to display their cruelty and their misanthropic activity and policy. We are carrying out a large set of measures directed at securing the safe holding of the Olympic Games. I proceed from the view that our special services and law-enforcement bodies will succeed in doing this. |
| К.Клеймёнов: Масштаб действительно колоссальный, но именно после Вашего предложения поесть баланду чиновникам положение людей, которые эту баланду ели в эвакуационном пункте… |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: The scale is indeed colossal, but precisely after your suggestion to eat borscht for officials, the situation of the people who ate this borscht in the evacuation point... |
| В.Путин: Как Вы заметили, я не стал там топать ногами, стучать кулаками и сразу увольнять всех. Понимаете, дело вот ещё в чём. Люди работали там днём и ночью. Обратите внимание, слава богу, у нас жертв нет. Дай бог, чтобы и дальше не было. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: As you noticed, I did not start stamping my feet there, banging my fists, and dismissing everyone at once. You see, there is also this. People worked there day and night. Note that, thank God, we have no casualties. God grant that there continue to be none. |
| К.Клеймёнов: Мародёрства нет. |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: There is no looting. |
| В.Путин: Мародёрства нет, преступности нет, повышения преступности и так далее. В принципе они работали днём и ночью, спасая людей, выводили их из мест проживания, куда вода пришла большая. Считали, что перевезли в эти казармы, слава богу, все живы и здоровы, ничего, займёмся другими делами, – а так нельзя, вот так нельзя. Нельзя людей бросать туда, чтобы, как они писали, сами стены красили и баланду ели. Пришлось напомнить, ничего здесь страшного нет. Я извиняюсь перед теми людьми, которые в таком положении оказались. Если местные чиновники не извинились до сих пор, я за них извиняюсь, но надо поправить, навести порядок. Я думаю, что уже многое там сделано, и ничего подобного дальше никто не допустит. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: There is no looting, there is no crime, no rise in crime, and so on. In principle they worked day and night, saving people, taking them out of the places where they lived, where a great deal of water had come. They reckoned that they had moved everyone into these barracks, thank God everyone was alive and well, it was all right, we would occupy ourselves with other matters — and one must not do that, one must not do that. One must not abandon people there so that, as they wrote, they painted the walls themselves and ate prison gruel. I had to give a reminder; there is nothing terrible in that. I apologize to those people who found themselves in such a position. If the local officials have not apologized to this day, I apologize for them, but it has to be put right, order has to be established. I think that much has already been done there, and no one will permit anything of the kind from now on. |
| Д.Данишевски: Олимпийские игры уже очень скоро, и кажется, что всё будет построено в срок. Но недавно возникла резонансная новость в связи с принятием законодательства против лиц с нетрадиционной сексуальной ориентацией. Вызовет ли это какие‑то негативные последствия для Олимпийских игр? |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: The Olympic Games are very soon, and it seems that everything will be built on time. But recently there was a resonant news related to the adoption of legislation against persons with non-traditional sexual orientation. Will this cause any negative consequences for the Olympic Games? |
| Matching Russian passage has not been identified |
Cached English source — passage alignment not verified John Daniszewski: Also around the Games, there is some concern about terrorism. I know some terrorist groups have made threats against the Games. Would you say the visitors, do they have to fear terrorism and what kind of extra measures might you need to take? We saw in Boston that it’s hard to protect sporting events. |
| 14 The LGBT Law and the Olympics | |
| В.Путин: Я надеюсь, что никаких негативных последствий не будет, тем более что у нас нет законов, направленных против лиц нетрадиционной сексуальной ориентации. Вот Вы сейчас об этом сказали, Вы как бы создаёте иллюзию у миллионов зрителей, что у нас есть такие законы, а в России таких законов нет. В России принят закон о запрете пропаганды нетрадиционной сексуальной ориентации среди несовершеннолетних, это совершенно разные вещи, это во‑первых. Во‑вторых, мы видим, что предпринимаются попытки как‑то дискредитировать проведение будущих Олимпийских игр, в том числе по этому признаку. И, к сожалению, мы видим эти попытки, в том числе из Соединённых Штатов. В этой связи я что хотел бы сказать? У нас, во‑первых, люди нетрадиционной ориентации никак не ущемляются ни в профессиональном смысле, ни в уровне заработной платы, ни, наконец, даже, если они достигают каких‑то высот в творчестве, в работе, они не ущемляются даже с точки зрения признания их результатов со стороны государства, я имею в виду награждение их орденами, медалями. Они абсолютно полноценные и равные в правах граждане Российской Федерации. Между тем те, кто нас пытается учить, в частности некоторые наши коллеги и друзья из Соединённых Штатов, они должны были бы знать, что в самих Соединённых Штатах немало проблем с людьми нетрадиционной ориентации. Вам известно, например, что в некоторых штатах в Соединённых Штатах до сих пор нетрадиционная сексуальная ориентация признается уголовным преступлением? В частности, в Оклахоме, как мне сказали, и в Техасе. Может быть, те, кто мне об этом говорил, ошибаются, но вы проверьте. И если это действительно так, то тогда вообще очень странной является ситуация, когда нас пытаются учить те, которые сами не являются примером для подражания. А статистика – и некоторые независимые неправительственные организации такую статистику ведут – они утверждают, я не говорю, что это так и есть, но они даже утверждают, что в некоторых американских компаниях люди нетрадиционной ориентации ущемляются даже в уровне заработной платы, и говорят, что есть статистика. Я этого не знаю, но надо проверять. Но вот то, что признается нетрадиционная ориентация уголовным преступлением, вы знаете, такой атавизм давно уже и у нас ликвидирован. У нас была, по‑моему, 120‑я статья в УК РСФСР, которая карала за нетрадиционную ориентацию. Давно всё отменено, у нас ничего подобного нет! А в некоторых странах это есть. Но мне кажется, что лучше нам не препираться друг с другом, не пытаться кого‑то изобразить дикарями, а других – цивилизованными людьми; объективно, профессионально и по‑партнёрски обращаться к вопросам соблюдения прав человека, и на этом поле тоже не толкаться локтями, а, давая объективную картину в этой сфере, совместно искать решения. Когда в стране проходят массовые спортивные мероприятия, безусловно, людей, которые начинают заниматься физической культурой и спортом, становится намного больше. Вот это самая главная составляющая того, почему мы идём на такие расходы. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: I hope there will be no negative consequences, all the more so since we have no laws directed against persons of nontraditional sexual orientation. You just said this; you are, as it were, creating an illusion for millions of viewers that we have such laws, and in Russia there are no such laws. In Russia a law has been adopted on the prohibition of propaganda of nontraditional sexual orientation among minors; these are completely different things; that is the first point. Second, we see that attempts are being undertaken somehow to discredit the holding of the future Olympic Games, including on this ground. And unfortunately we see these attempts, including from the United States. In this connection, what would I like to say? With us, first, people of nontraditional orientation are in no way infringed either in the professional sense, or in the level of wages, or, finally, even if they attain some heights in creative work, in work, they are not infringed even from the point of view of recognition of their results by the state; I mean the awarding of orders and medals to them. They are absolutely full and equal-in-rights citizens of the Russian Federation. Meanwhile those who try to teach us, in particular some of our colleagues and friends from the United States, ought to know that in the United States themselves there are quite a few problems with people of nontraditional orientation. Is it known to you, for example, that in some states in the United States nontraditional sexual orientation is still recognized as a criminal offense? In particular in Oklahoma, as I was told, and in Texas. Perhaps those who told me this are mistaken, but you check. And if this is really so, then the situation is altogether very strange, when those who themselves are not an example to follow try to teach us. And the statistics — and some independent nongovernmental organizations keep such statistics — they assert, I am not saying that this is so, but they even assert that in some American companies people of nontraditional orientation are infringed even in the level of wages, and they say that there are statistics. I do not know this, but one must check. But that nontraditional orientation is recognized as a criminal offense — you know, such an atavism was liquidated with us long ago too. We had, I think, Article 120 in the Criminal Code of the RSFSR, which punished nontraditional orientation. Everything was repealed long ago; we have nothing of the kind! And in some countries this exists. But it seems to me it would be better for us not to wrangle with each other, not to try to depict some as savages and others as civilized people; to turn objectively, professionally, and in a partner-like way to questions of the observance of human rights, and on this field too not to elbow one another, but, giving an objective picture in this sphere, jointly to seek solutions. When mass sports events take place in a country, without doubt the number of people who begin to engage in physical culture and sport becomes much greater. This is the most important component of why we go to such expenditures. |
| Д.Данишевски: Когда говорится о том, что пропаганда нетрадиционной сексуальной ориентации является преступлением, будет ли преступлением ношение знаков, символизирующих такие отношения? Это радуга, радужные знаки. |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: When it is said that the propaganda of non-traditional sexual orientation is a crime, will wearing signs symbolizing such relationships be a crime? It is a rainbow, rainbow signs. |
| Matching Russian passage has not been identified |
Cached English source — passage alignment not verified John Daniszewski: Furthermore about the Olympics, I understand that you are spending something like 50 or 60 billion dollars on Sochi to make the facilities and the roads and so on. Could you just explain why this investment is worth it for the country. I believe it’s more than any other country has ever spent on the Olympics. ”In 2008–2010, the time of economic crisis, the construction of Olympic facilities turned out to be a major anti-crisis measure, as we created several thousands of jobs there and engaged specialists from all the regions of the Russian Federation. This helps improve the quality and the level of our construction organisations and facilitates international cooperation.“ |
| В.Путин: Не будет. У нас люди, которые выступили инициаторами этих законов и которые принимали этот закон – я, кстати, не был инициатором этого закона, – исходили из того, что однополые браки не производят детей. А Россия переживает непростые времена с точки зрения демографии. И мы заинтересованы в том, чтобы семьи были полноценные, чтобы детей было больше. Это далеко не самое главное во всей системе мер, направленных на поддержку демографических процессов. Но я думаю, что авторы этого закона исходили прежде всего из необходимости решать проблемы демографического характера и далеки были от идеи кого‑то ущемлять в правах. И уж точно совершенно во время проведения Олимпийских игр, других массовых спортивных мероприятий, особенно Олимпийских игр, можно быть абсолютно уверенными в том, что Россия будет строго придерживаться принципов олимпизма, которые не допускают дискриминации людей по какому бы то ни было признаку: по национальному, по гендерному либо по тому, о котором Вы сказали, по признаку сексуальной ориентации. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: There will not be. Our people who came forward as the initiators of these laws, and who adopted this law — I, by the way, was not the initiator of this law — proceeded from the view that same-sex marriages do not produce children. And Russia is living through difficult times from the point of view of demography. And we have an interest in families being full ones, in there being more children. This is far from the chief thing in the whole system of measures directed at supporting demographic processes. But I think the authors of this law proceeded above all from the need to solve problems of a demographic character, and were far from any idea of infringing anyone's rights. And certainly during the holding of the Olympic Games and other mass sporting events, and of the Olympic Games especially, one can be absolutely confident that Russia will adhere strictly to the principles of Olympism, which do not allow discrimination against people on any ground whatever: national, or by gender, or on the ground you mentioned, the ground of sexual orientation. |
| Д.Данишевски: Недавно говорили, что Президент Обама хотел бы встретиться с представителями ЛГБТ. Сделали бы Вы то же самое в преддверии Игр или в целом? |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: Recently it was said that President Obama would like to meet with representatives of the LGBT. Would you do the same thing on the eve of the Games or in general? |
| Matching Russian passage has not been identified |
Cached English source — passage alignment not verified John Daniszewski: Well, I hope there will be a lot of snow; I hope that all those who will come to the Olympic Games, both athletes and coaches, specialists, spectators, journalists, all of them will find themselves in a festive atmosphere, and that we will be able to create this atmosphere, that we will manage to be hospitable hosts and that we shall succeed in holding the Olympics at the highest level. ”I believe that intelligentsia should prevent from any abrupt steps and revolutions of different types and nature. We have just had enough; we have already experienced so much, both in terms of revolutions and wars that we need decades of calm and smooth development.“ |
| Matching Russian passage has not been identified | Kirill Kleymenov: Mr President, you know, we all depend to some extent on the historical context. Here comes the year of the 100 th anniversary of the outbreak of the First World War, the war that led to the collapse of the Russian Empire. Back then, the reason for the collapse was, to a large extent, in the disloyalty of the elites to their own state. Later, similar allusions could be traced in 1991 as well, when the Soviet Union was collapsing. Do you think that today’s Russian elites are loyal to the state? |
| В.Путин: Если кто‑то хочет со мной из них встретиться – пожалуйста, но пока такой инициативы не было. У нас много всяких групп, много различных организаций, объединений, я, как правило, встречаюсь со всеми, кто высказывает просьбу о встрече и предлагает обсудить какую‑то проблему, которую считает важной. Пока не было таких предложений. Почему нет? Я Вас уверяю, что я работаю с такими людьми, я их иногда награждаю государственными медалями и орденами за их достижения в тех или других сферах. У нас абсолютно нормальные отношения, и я не вижу здесь ничего особенного. Вот говорят, что Пётр Ильич Чайковский был гомосексуалистом, правда, мы любим его не за это, но он был великий музыкант, и мы все любим его музыку. Ну и что? Не надо делать из мухи слона, ничего страшного здесь, у нас в стране, и ужасного не происходит. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: If any of them wants to meet me — please, but so far there has been no such initiative. We have many different groups, many different organizations and associations; as a rule I meet everyone who expresses a request for a meeting and proposes to discuss some problem he considers important. So far there have been no such proposals. Why not? I assure you that I work with such people; I sometimes award them state medals and orders for their achievements in one sphere or another. We have entirely normal relations, and I see nothing special here. People say that Pyotr Ilyich Tchaikovsky was a homosexual; true, we love him not for that, but he was a great musician, and we all love his music. So what? One must not make an elephant out of a fly; nothing terrible is happening here in our country, and nothing dreadful. |
| Д.Данишевски: В связи с проведением Олимпийских игр некоторые обеспокоены вопросом безопасности. Мы знаем, что некоторые террористические группировки уже высказали свою угрозу по отношению к безопасности на Играх. Какие дополнительные меры, возможно, должны быть предприняты, учитывая события в Бостоне, например, для того чтобы обеспечить безопасность на спортивных мероприятиях? |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: In connection with the Olympic Games, some are concerned about the issue of security. We know that some terrorist organizations have already expressed their threat to the security of the Games. What additional measures, perhaps, should be taken, taking into account the events in Boston, for example, to ensure security at sporting events? |
| 15 Olympic Security and Terrorism | |
| В.Путин: Террористы всегда кому‑то угрожают. Если мы будем их бояться, то, значит, они победили. Но это не значит, что мы должны относиться наплевательски к этим угрозам. Мы должны сделать всё, для того чтобы их купировать, эти угрозы, не дать террористам ни одного шанса на проявление своей жестокости и человеконенавистнической деятельности и политики. Мы, разумеется, проводим очень большой комплекс мероприятий, направленных на обеспечение безопасности проведения Олимпийских игр. Я исхожу из того, что нашим специальным службам и правоохранительным органам, безусловно, удастся это сделать. Что можно было бы сделать дополнительно для обеспечения безопасности? В этом случае крайне важно сотрудничество между коллегами на правоохранительном треке. Должен сообщить Вам о том, что у нас есть соответствующие договорённости и с американскими партнёрами: и по линии ФБР, по линии других специальных служб, – с европейскими партнёрами. Все эти люди осознают свою ответственность перед спортсменами, перед любителями спорта, перед зрителями. И надеюсь, что их совместная работа будет эффективной и обеспечит полную и абсолютную безопасность проведения Олимпийских игр в Сочи. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: Terrorists always threaten someone. If we fear them, that means they have won. But that does not mean we should treat these threats with a shrug. We must do everything to cut these threats off, and not give the terrorists a single chance to display their cruelty and their misanthropic activity and policy. We are of course carrying out a very large set of measures directed at securing the safe holding of the Olympic Games. I proceed from the view that our special services and law-enforcement bodies will certainly succeed in doing this. What could be done additionally to ensure security? In this case cooperation among colleagues on the law-enforcement track is extremely important. I must tell you that we have the corresponding understandings with our American partners too — both through the FBI and through other special services — and with our European partners. All these people are conscious of their responsibility to the athletes, to lovers of sport, to the spectators. And I hope their joint work will be effective and will ensure the full and absolute security of the Olympic Games in Sochi. |
| Д.Данишевски: Ещё один вопрос по Олимпийским играм. Я понимаю, что вы потратили 50 или 60 миллиардов долларов на подготовку к Сочи, для того чтобы построить объекты, инфраструктуру, дороги. Объясните, пожалуйста, оправданны ли такие инвестиции для вашей страны? Я думаю, что ваша страна вложила гораздо больше, чем какая‑либо страна во время подготовки к Олимпийским играм. В период 2008–2010 годов, в условиях кризиса, строительство олимпийских объектов было очень мощной антикризисной мерой, потому что мы создали там несколько тысяч рабочих мест, со всех регионов Российской Федерации специалисты приехали. Это повышает качество и уровень наших строительных организаций, способствует международной кооперации. |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: Another question about the Olympic Games. I understand that you spent 50 or 60 billion dollars on preparing for Sochi, in order to build facilities, infrastructure, roads. Please explain, are such investments justified for your country? I think that your country invested much more than any country during the preparation for the Olympic Games. During the 2008–2010 years, in the conditions of a crisis, the construction of Olympic facilities was a very powerful anti-crisis measure, because we created several thousand jobs there, specialists came from all regions of the Russian Federation. This improves the quality and level of our construction organizations, promotes international cooperation. |
| 13 Sochi Olympics Spending Justified | |
| В.Путин: Наша страна вложила, может быть, больше денег в целом в подготовку, но наша страна не вложила денег больше, чем какая‑либо другая страна собственно на олимпийские объекты. Всего на подготовку к Олимпийским играм будет истрачено 214 миллиардов рублей. Можно посчитать легко, сколько это в долларах, за один доллар сегодня дают 33 рубля. Из них 100 миллиардов – чисто государственное финансирование, а 114 – за счёт инвесторов. Ещё больше денег израсходовано на инфраструктуру. Мы делали это сознательно. Мы делали это для того, чтобы юг Российской Федерации, а Россия достаточно северная страна, был привлекательным и комфортным, и не только во время проведения Олимпийских игр, но и на десятилетия потом. Чтобы наши граждане не уезжали куда‑то на отдых, в Турцию, в Европу, в Италию и так далее, а оставляли свои деньги здесь, чтобы наш регион, достаточно хороший по климатическим условиям, предоставлял нашим же гражданам возможности для отдыха круглый год. И мы вполне в состоянии были бы это сделать и без Олимпийских игр. Но я думаю, что вы меня поймёте, это весьма сложно в условиях постоянной ограниченности в бюджетных средствах, а вот когда есть Олимпийские игры, тогда мы уже обязаны сделать то, сё, пятое, десятое. А что конкретно? Мы построили сотни километров новых дорог, десятки мостов – десятки мостов! – и тоннелей. Мы построили фактически две новые дороги, одна была реконструирована, она фактически как новая, а вторая совсем новая, автомобильные дороги от берега моря в горный кластер. Мы построили от берега моря в горный кластер железную дорогу. Мы проложили две дополнительные газовые трубы, чтобы обеспечить энергетику в регионе. Мы построили электростанцию и 17 подстанций. Мы создали новый медицинский центр, мы построили 43 гостиницы с десятками тысяч современных гостиничных мест. Вот всё это, надеюсь, будет служить людям на десятки лет вперёд. И на это денег не жалко, потому что это деньги для того, чтобы граждане Российской Федерации могли пользоваться тем, что сделано, как я уже сказал, на протяжении десятилетий, это для людей сделали, а не только для проведения этих крупных соревнований. Конечно, это интересно, это престижно, но не это для нас главное. И есть ещё одна составляющая, которая, на мой взгляд, является весьма существенной, – это пропаганда спорта и здорового образа жизни. Когда в стране проходят такие массовые спортивные мероприятия, безусловно, людей, которые начинают заниматься физической культурой и спортом, становится намного больше, чем до проведения мероприятий подобного рода. Вот это самая главная составляющая того, почему мы идём на такие расходы. А куда тратить, если не для людей? У нас есть доходы, скажем, от нефтегазового сектора. Мы значительную часть их тратим туда. Кроме всего прочего, Вы знаете, в период 2008–2010 годов, в условиях кризиса, строительство олимпийских объектов было очень мощной антикризисной мерой, потому что мы создали там несколько тысяч рабочих мест, со всех регионов Российской Федерации специалисты приехали. Мы целые города там построили. Это повышает качество и уровень наших строительных организаций, это способствует кооперации международной, некоторые вопросы достаточно сложно решались. Я очень рассчитываю на то, что сложившиеся рабочие коллективы, во всяком случае, часть из них, будет потом использована в различных регионах России, в том числе, может быть, и на юге, для продолжения строительства инфраструктурных объектов. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: Our country has invested, perhaps, more money on the whole in the preparation, but our country has not invested more money than any other country on the Olympic facilities proper. In all, 214 billion rubles will be spent on preparation for the Olympic Games. One can easily calculate how much this is in dollars; for one dollar today they give 33 rubles. Of that, 100 billion is purely state financing, and 114 is at the expense of investors. Still more money has been spent on infrastructure. We did this consciously. We did this so that the south of the Russian Federation — and Russia is a fairly northern country — would be attractive and comfortable, and not only during the holding of the Olympic Games but for decades afterward. So that our citizens would not go off somewhere on holiday, to Turkey, to Europe, to Italy, and so on, but would leave their money here, so that our region, fairly good in climatic conditions, would provide our own citizens with possibilities for rest all year round. And we would have been quite in a position to do this even without the Olympic Games. But I think you will understand me: this is quite difficult under conditions of a constant limitation in budget funds, whereas when there are Olympic Games, then we are already obliged to do this, that, and the other. And what specifically? We built hundreds of kilometers of new roads, dozens of bridges — dozens of bridges! — and tunnels. We built in effect two new roads; one was reconstructed, it is in effect like a new one, and the second is entirely new, motor roads from the seashore into the mountain cluster. We built a railway from the seashore into the mountain cluster. We laid two additional gas pipes in order to provide energy in the region. We built a power station and 17 substations. We created a new medical center; we built 43 hotels with tens of thousands of modern hotel places. All of this, I hope, will serve people for tens of years ahead. And one does not begrudge money for this, because this is money so that the citizens of the Russian Federation can use what has been done, as I have already said, over the course of decades; this was done for people, and not only for the holding of these large competitions. Of course this is interesting, this is prestigious, but this is not the main thing for us. And there is one more component that, in my view, is quite substantial — the promotion of sport and a healthy way of life. When such mass sports events take place in a country, without doubt the number of people who begin to engage in physical culture and sport becomes much greater than before the holding of events of this kind. This is the most important component of why we go to such expenditures. And where is one to spend, if not for people? We have revenues, say, from the oil and gas sector. We spend a significant part of them there. Besides everything else, you know, in the period 2008–2010, under conditions of crisis, the construction of the Olympic facilities was a very powerful anti-crisis measure, because we created several thousand jobs there; specialists came from all the regions of the Russian Federation. We built whole cities there. This raises the quality and level of our construction organizations; this contributes to international cooperation; some questions were solved with fair difficulty. I count very much on the work collectives that have taken shape, in any case part of them, afterward being used in various regions of Russia, including perhaps in the south, for the continuation of the construction of infrastructure facilities. |
| Д.Данишевски: Сможете ли Вы сейчас предсказать результаты игры хоккейной команды России? |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: Can you now predict the results of the Russian hockey team's game? |
| Matching Russian passage has not been identified |
Cached English source — passage alignment not verified John Daniszewski: A little while ago you were talking about the intelligentsia, the loyal intelligentsia, and I was wondering about two things. What do you think about those Russians who are leaving Russia and going abroad? Is that disloyal of them to be leaving at this time? And then I also wondered about the Moscow Mayor’s race where major opposition figure is a candidate. Is it alright for a major opposition member to become mayor of the capital city? |
| В.Путин: Конечно, могу. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: Of course I can. |
| Д.Данишевски: Хорошо, посмотрим. |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: Okay, let's see. |
| В.Путин: А что Вы посмотрите? Я же не сказал, какие мои прогнозы. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: And what will you look at? I did not say what my forecasts are. |
| Д.Данишевски: Я подумал, что Вы предскажете победу России. Мы знаем, что будет много снега. Олимпийские игры: и спортсмены, и тренеры, специалисты, зрители, журналисты, – что все они попадут в обстановку праздника, и нам удастся создать эту обстановку, удастся быть радушными хозяевами и удастся провести Олимпийские игры на самом высоком уровне. Именно интеллигенция должна предупреждать от резких движений и от революций различного рода и толка. Нам хватит, мы уже столько пережили и революций, и войн, нам нужны десятилетия спокойного, ритмичного развития. |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: I thought that you would predict Russia's victory. We know there will be a lot of snow. Olympic Games: athletes, coaches, specialists, spectators, journalists – all of them will be caught up in the festive atmosphere, and we will succeed in creating this atmosphere, will succeed in being hospitable hosts, and will succeed in conducting the Olympic Games at the highest level. It is precisely the intelligentsia that should warn against sharp movements and against revolutions of various kinds and sorts. We have had enough; we have already experienced so many revolutions and wars; we need decades of calm, rhythmic development. |
| Matching Russian passage has not been identified |
Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: Everyone works this way; I think the situation is quite the same in the USA or in any other country. However, there are, of course, situations and there are some political groups that prefer not to have any contacts. Nevertheless, this is a road to nowhere, this is a path to confrontation and disorder. However, the number of different parties, represented at elections at different levels, such as municipal or regional, has increased, and this is a fact. The number of such parties has increased many-folds. Are they independent or not? Of course! They are absolutely independent! This being said, there are political parties that are trying to cooperate with the authorities, trying to make changes in actions of the executive authorities. There are some parties that simply criticise and put forward more rational and effective (as it seems) solutions to the problems that a certain region or the country in general is facing. Nevertheless, the fact that they are independent is obvious. You have just mentioned some of our oppositionists. Are they independent, or do you suspect them of it? Well, I guess what I’m trying to get at is whether there is a sort of “tame” opposition as opposed to “hard” opposition. I guess it’s a matter of degree in some cases. You do have people like Mr Navalny, who I just mentioned and who seems to be very much attacking the system from the outside? Can he work in the political system and succeed? ”Regarding the election of the Moscow mayor. No matter who is elected by Muscovites, the federal government will work with any future mayor of Moscow, this is an indisputable fact. However, great experience and skills are required to govern a metropolis like Moscow.“ |
| К.Клеймёнов: Владимир Владимирович, Вы знаете, мы все зависим в какой‑то степени от исторического контекста. Вот приближается год столетия начала Первой мировой войны, войны, которая привела к распаду Российской Империи. И тогда во многом причиной краха стала нелояльность элит собственному государству. Затем какие‑то подобные аллюзии можно проследить и в 91‑м году, когда умирал Советский Союз. Как по‑Вашему, сегодняшние российские элиты лояльны государству? |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: Vladimir Vladimirovich, you know, we are all dependent to some extent on the historical context. Here, the centenary of the beginning of the First World War, the war that led to the collapse of the Russian Empire, is approaching. And then, to a large extent, the cause of the collapse was the disloyalty of the elites to their own state. Then similar allusions can be traced in the 91-th year, when the Soviet Union was dying. In your opinion, are today's Russian elites loyal to the state? |
| 16 Elite Loyalty, the Intelligentsia and Revolution | |
| В.Путин: Дело не только в элитах, всегда в обществе есть какие‑то бациллы, разрушающие этот общественный организм или государственный организм. Но они активизируются тогда, когда иммунитет падает, когда возникают проблемы, когда начинают страдать массы, миллионы людей. Эти миллионы уже считают, что хуже уже не будет, давайте будем что‑то менять любой ценой, мы всё там сметём, мы свой, мы новый мир построим, «кто был ничем, тот станет всем». На самом деле так не получилось, как хотелось бы. Что касается лояльности или нелояльности элит. Наверное, может быть, есть такая специфическая проблема. Пушкин, по‑моему, – его, кстати, никто не заподозрит в том, что он был сатрапом государственным или царским сатрапом, наоборот, он был человеком свободолюбивым, он дружил с декабристами, и в этом‑то уж никто не сомневается, – но даже он однажды сказал: «У нас очень много людей, которые стоят в оппозиции не к правительству, а к России». Такая традиция у нашей интеллигенции, к сожалению, есть. Но связано это с тем, что всегда хочется подчеркнуть свою цивилизованность, свою образованность, всегда хочется сориентироваться на лучшие образцы. Ну, может быть, это и неизбежно на каком‑то этапе развития. Но, без всяких сомнений, вот эта потеря государственной самоидентичности и в период развала Российской Империи, и в период развала Советского Союза, она была губительной и разрушительной. Надо заранее это понимать и не допускать такого состояния государства, в котором оно находилось на завершающем этапе Первой мировой войны или, например, в последние годы существования Советского Союза, когда у нас уже и мыло‑то по талонам отпускалось. Помните анекдот, когда семья приходит в гости к другой, и её спрашивают: «Вы чай будете пить с сахаром?» – «Да, с сахаром». – «Ну, тогда руки будете мыть без мыла». Шутки‑то шутками, но люди, видимо, считали, что хуже уже не будет. Но мы все должны понимать: как только начинаются революционные – не эволюционные, а революционные – перемены, так может быть хуже, причём намного. И полагаю, что это понимание должно быть прежде всего как раз у интеллигенции. И именно интеллигенция должна, понимая это, предупреждать от резких движений и от революций различного рода и толка. Нам хватит, мы уже столько пережили и революций, и войн, нам нужны десятилетия спокойного, ритмичного развития. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: The point is not only the elites; there are always some bacilli in society that destroy this social organism or the state organism. But they become active when immunity falls, when problems arise, when the masses, millions of people, begin to suffer. These millions already consider that it will not get worse, let us change something at any price, we will sweep everything away there, we will build our own, our new world, "who was nothing will become everything." In fact it did not turn out as one would have wished. As for the loyalty or disloyalty of the elites. Probably, perhaps, there is such a specific problem. Pushkin, I think — no one, by the way, will suspect him of having been a state satrap or a tsarist satrap; on the contrary, he was a freedom-loving person, he was friends with the Decembrists, and of this no one has any doubt — but even he once said: "We have a great many people who stand in opposition not to the government but to Russia." Such a tradition, unfortunately, exists among our intelligentsia. But this is connected with the fact that one always wants to emphasize one's civilization, one's education; one always wants to orient oneself on the best models. Well, perhaps this is inevitable at some stage of development. But, without any doubt, this loss of state self-identity, both in the period of the collapse of the Russian Empire and in the period of the collapse of the Soviet Union, was ruinous and destructive. One must understand this in advance and not allow such a condition of the state as it was in at the concluding stage of the First World War or, for example, in the last years of the existence of the Soviet Union, when even soap was issued to us by coupons. Do you remember the joke, when a family comes to visit another and is asked: "Will you drink tea with sugar?" — "Yes, with sugar." — "Well, then you will wash your hands without soap." Jokes are jokes, but people apparently considered that it would not get worse. But we must all understand: as soon as revolutionary — not evolutionary, but revolutionary — changes begin, it can be worse, and much worse. And I suppose that this understanding must be, above all, precisely among the intelligentsia. And it is precisely the intelligentsia that must, understanding this, warn against sharp movements and against revolutions of various kinds and persuasions. We have had enough; we have already lived through so many revolutions and wars; we need decades of calm, rhythmic development. |
| К.Клеймёнов: Вот про спокойное, ритмичное развитие. Если позволите, вопрос про Украину. Почему не получается спокойно и ритмично развиваться вместе? Почему не удаётся создать общее пространство с людьми, с которыми мы живём столетия рядом, у нас очень похожий менталитет? Вы же часто встречаетесь с украинским руководством. В чём загвоздка всё‑таки, на Ваш взгляд? |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: Here is about calm, rhythmic development. If you allow, a question about Ukraine. Why is it not possible to develop calmly and rhythmically together? Why is it not possible to create a common space with people with whom we have lived side by side for centuries, whose mentality is very similar to ours? You often meet with the Ukrainian leadership. What is the snag, in your opinion? |
| 17 Ukraine — One People and the EU Association Risk | |
| В.Путин: Вы знаете, что бы ни происходило и куда бы Украина ни шла, мы всё равно когда‑то и где‑то встретимся. Почему? Потому что мы один народ. И как бы на то, что я сейчас сказал, ни сердились националисты с обеих сторон, а националисты есть и у нас, и на Украине, на самом деле оно так и есть. Потому что у нас одна днепровская, киевская купель, у нас, безусловно, общие исторические корни и общие судьбы, у нас общая религия, общая вера, у нас очень схожая культура, языки, традиции и менталитет, как Вы правильно сказали. Есть, безусловно, свои особенности и своя этническая окраска во всём. Кстати, украинская культура, украинский язык, танцы, музыка – они замечательные. Я, например, восхищаюсь всегда этим. Куда бы Украина ни шла, мы всё равно когда‑то и где‑то встретимся. Потому что мы один народ, у нас одна днепровская, киевская купель, у нас, безусловно, общие исторические корни и общие судьбы, у нас общая религия, общая вера, у нас очень схожая культура, языки, традиции и менталитет. И Вы сейчас упоминали про революционные события после Первой мировой войны, обращаю Ваше внимание, и про элиты говорили. Вот что любопытно? И белое движение, и красное дрались между собой насмерть, миллионы людей погибли в ходе гражданской войны, но никогда не ставили вопроса об отделении Украины. И красные, и белые исходили из целостности Российского государства. Что касается этой части, Украины, это край, то мы понимаем и помним, что мы родились, как я сказал, из общеукраинской днепровской купели, там зарождалась Русь, и мы все оттуда родом. Так случилось, что часть этой территории оказывалась в руках различных государств, которые находились западнее от этих территорий, и все эти годы, все эти столетия украинский народ терпел большие лишения, по сути, страдал, в таком рабском унизительном положении находился. Только после воссоединения обеих частей Руси эта часть Украины начала развиваться и, по сути, процветать. За время совместного единого сосуществования Украина превратилась в большое европейское государство, получив дополнительные территории, население, причём это и за счёт России, за счёт некоторых областей на западе. Советский Союз произвёл такие обмены и наградил Украину этими территориями. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: You know, whatever happens and wherever Ukraine goes, we will still meet sometime and somewhere. Why? Because we are one people. And however the nationalists on both sides may be angry at what I have just said — and there are nationalists both with us and in Ukraine — in fact it is so. Because we have one Dnieper, Kievan font; we have, without doubt, common historical roots and common destinies; we have a common religion, a common faith; we have a very similar culture, languages, traditions, and mentality, as you rightly said. There are, without doubt, peculiarities of one's own and one's own ethnic coloring in everything. By the way, Ukrainian culture, the Ukrainian language, dances, music — they are remarkable. I, for example, always admire this. Wherever Ukraine goes, we will still meet sometime and somewhere. Because we are one people; we have one Dnieper, Kievan font; we have, without doubt, common historical roots and common destinies; we have a common religion, a common faith; we have a very similar culture, languages, traditions, and mentality. And you just mentioned the revolutionary events after the First World War — I draw your attention to this — and you spoke of the elites. Here is what is curious. Both the White movement and the Red fought each other to the death; millions of people perished in the course of the civil war, but they never raised the question of separating Ukraine. Both the Reds and the Whites proceeded from the integrity of the Russian state. As for this part, Ukraine — this is a borderland — we understand and remember that we were born, as I said, from the common Ukrainian Dnieper font; Rus arose there, and we all come from there. It so happened that part of this territory ended up in the hands of various states that lay to the west of these territories, and all these years, all these centuries, the Ukrainian people endured great hardships, in essence suffered, and was in a slavish, humiliating position. Only after the reunification of both parts of Rus did this part of Ukraine begin to develop and, in essence, to flourish. Over the time of joint, united coexistence Ukraine turned into a large European state, receiving additional territories and population, and this also at Russia's expense, at the expense of some regions in the west. The Soviet Union carried out such exchanges and awarded Ukraine these territories. |
| К.Клеймёнов: На юге. |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: In the south. |
| 18 Emigration, the Moscow Mayor Race and the Opposition | |
| В.Путин: На юге, это не важно, во всяком случае, она превратилась в крупное государство. Были проведены колоссальные инвестиции в инфраструктуру, в развитие промышленности и так далее. Но так получилось сегодня, что мы живём в разных государствах. Надо исходить из реалий, надо исходить из того, что значительная часть украинского народа дорожит самостийностью, то есть независимостью. Нужно не только это принимать, нужно это уважать. Кстати говоря, только при уважении взаимных интересов и вот таких подходов можно решать общие вопросы, представляющие общий интерес. Что касается интеграционных процессов, мы должны и здесь относиться с уважением к Украине. Если Украина считает, что ей нужно и целесообразнее заключать, скажем, договор о зоне свободной торговли с Евросоюзом, значит, так тому и быть. Но мы видим здесь определённые проблемы для нас и для них. В чём они заключаются? Что такое зона свободной торговли, ассоциированное членство? Не помню, как там эти документы называются, но суть их мне известна. Суть заключается в том, что Украина берёт на себя дополнительные обязательства по снижению таможенной защиты, таможенных барьеров. По значительной группе товаров, то, что скажу, понятно, даже не нужно быть специалистом, Украина в течение какого‑то времени, а по некоторым сразу, обнуляет ввозные таможенные пошлины – это первое. И, второе, вводит европейские стандартны регулирования, технического регулирования. Сейчас скажу, что это такое. Когда обнуляются пошлины, появляется товар иностранного производства на украинском рынке, а свои‑то предприятия работают, куда свой‑то товар девать? У нас есть опасение, что они будут выдавливаться на наш рынок, на рынок Таможенного союза, на рынок России, Казахстана и Белоруссии. Но мы так не договаривались, это будет создавать проблемы для нашей экономики – это первое. И второе. Что такое внедрить у себя в одночасье технические стандарты? Это значит, что украинские предприятия должны будут выпускать всё, не знаю, лифт, машину, рубашку, часы и прочее – все остальные товары по техническим регламентам Евросоюза. Они хорошие, но они очень жёсткие, и чтобы предприятия так работали, по этим регламентам, нужны инвестиции многомиллиардные, время нужно. Сомневаюсь, что это возможно сделать в одночасье. А пока это будут делать, многие предприятия уже разорятся или опять же будут выталкивать товары на наш рынок. Мы вынуждены будем закрываться – вот в чём проблема. А это к чему может привести? У нас есть очевидные конкурентные преимущества: у нас общая транспортная инфраструктура, общая энергетика, у нас кооперация глубокая, у нас общий язык. Это большие конкурентные преимущества, они исчезнут. Я с трудом себе представляю, как будет развиваться ракетно-космическая отрасль Украины. Она очень солидная – и ракетная отрасль и авиация. Я просто не представляю без нашего рынка. Моторостроение авиационное. Наши все вертолёты оснащены украинскими двигателями. Что нам делать? Как это будет всё развиваться или не будет вообще? Нельзя людей обвинять в том, что они ищут для себя достойную работу и находят её где‑то за пределами Российской Федерации. Наша задача не в том, чтобы «хватать и не пущать», а в том, чтобы создать самим, здесь, на территории Российской Федерации, достойные условия жизни и оплаты труда для высококлассных специалистов. Поэтому вопрос не в том, что мы хотим или не хотим, держим или не держим. Мы и сами ведём переговоры ведь с Евросоюзом. И о зоне свободной торговли думаем, мы думаем о том, чтобы заключить новое базовое соглашение. Но, Вы знаете, я же ведь очень давно и хорошо знаю наших европейских партнёров, они очень хорошие ребята, с ними и пивка можно махнуть немецкого, и шнапса выпить, и бокал вина французского или итальянского выпить вкусного. Но, когда они садятся за стол переговоров, это очень жёсткие люди, очень прагматичные, и чего‑то получить от них – это, знаете, сложная задача. Поэтому мне казалось, что если бы мы в рамках единого экономического пространства вместе бы определили какие‑то принципы, то разговаривать, скажем, европейцам с нами в составе Россия – Украина – Казахстан – Белоруссия было бы гораздо сложнее, чем поодиночке с каждым, тем более в отношениях напрямую только с одной Украиной. Ну посмотрим, каким будет выбор украинского руководства. К любому, какой бы выбор ни был сделан, мы отнесёмся с уважением и, безусловно, будем продолжать работать. Но вопрос просто только в том, как будем работать, что мы должны будем предпринять для защиты своих собственных интересов. Видно будет. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: In the south — this is not important; in any case it turned into a large state. Colossal investments were made in infrastructure, in the development of industry, and so on. But it has so turned out today that we live in different states. One must proceed from the realities; one must proceed from the fact that a significant part of the Ukrainian people treasures samostiinist, that is, independence. One must not only accept this; one must respect it. By the way, only with respect for mutual interests and for such approaches can common questions representing a common interest be solved. As for integration processes, we must treat Ukraine with respect here too. If Ukraine considers that it needs to and that it is more expedient to conclude, say, an agreement on a free-trade zone with the European Union, then so be it. But we see definite problems here for us and for them. What do they consist of? What is a free-trade zone, associated membership? I do not remember what those documents are called there, but their essence is known to me. The essence consists in Ukraine taking upon itself additional obligations to lower customs protection, customs barriers. For a significant group of goods — what I will say is understandable; one does not even need to be a specialist — Ukraine, over the course of some time, and for some at once, zeroes out import customs duties; that is the first thing. And, the second, it introduces European standards of regulation, of technical regulation. I will say now what this is. When duties are zeroed out, a good of foreign production appears on the Ukrainian market, and one's own enterprises are working; where is one to put one's own good? We have a fear that they will be squeezed out onto our market, onto the market of the Customs Union, onto the market of Russia, Kazakhstan, and Belarus. But we did not agree so; this will create problems for our economy — that is the first thing. And the second. What does it mean to introduce technical standards at home overnight? It means that Ukrainian enterprises will have to produce everything — I do not know, an elevator, a car, a shirt, a watch, and the rest — all the other goods according to the technical regulations of the European Union. They are good, but they are very strict, and for enterprises to work that way, according to these regulations, multi-billion investments are needed; time is needed. I doubt that this can be done overnight. And while they are doing this, many enterprises will already go bankrupt or, again, will push goods out onto our market. We will be forced to close ourselves off — that is the problem. And what can this lead to? We have obvious competitive advantages: we have a common transport infrastructure, a common energy system, we have deep cooperation, we have a common language. These are great competitive advantages; they will disappear. I have difficulty imagining how Ukraine's rocket and space branch will develop. It is a very solid one — both the rocket branch and aviation. I simply cannot imagine it without our market. Aircraft engine-building. All our helicopters are equipped with Ukrainian engines. What are we to do? How will all this develop, or will it not at all? One cannot accuse people of seeking worthy work for themselves and finding it somewhere outside the Russian Federation. Our task is not to "grab and not let go," but to create ourselves, here, on the territory of the Russian Federation, worthy conditions of life and of pay for high-class specialists. So the question is not that we want or do not want, hold or do not hold. We ourselves are conducting negotiations with the European Union, after all. And we are thinking about a free-trade zone; we are thinking about concluding a new basic agreement. But, you know, I have known our European partners for a very long time and well; they are very good fellows; with them one can toss back a German beer, and drink schnapps, and drink a glass of tasty French or Italian wine. But when they sit down at the negotiating table, these are very tough people, very pragmatic, and to get something from them is, you know, a hard task. So it seemed to me that if, within the framework of a single economic space, we had together defined some principles, then it would be much harder for the Europeans to talk, say, with us in the composition of Russia — Ukraine — Kazakhstan — Belarus than one by one with each, all the more so in relations directly with Ukraine alone. Well, we will see what the choice of the Ukrainian leadership will be. Whatever choice is made, we will treat it with respect and will without doubt continue to work. But the question is simply only how we will work, what we will have to undertake to protect our own interests. It will be seen. |
| Д.Данишевски: Когда Вы говорили про интеллигенцию, мне стало интересно две вещи. Думаете ли Вы, что много русских уезжает из России? Правильно ли это? Соответствует ли это духу времени? Также я хотел бы поговорить по поводу предвыборной гонки на пост мэра Москвы, где один из кандидатов – от оппозиции. Станет ли это правильно, если он станет мэром столицы? |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: When you spoke about the intelligentsia, two things became interesting to me. Do you think that many Russians are leaving Russia? Is this correct? Does this correspond to the spirit of the times? Also, I would like to talk about the mayoral election in Moscow, where one of the candidates is from the opposition. Will it be correct if he becomes the mayor of the capital? |
| Matching Russian passage has not been identified |
Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Kirill Kleymenov: First of all, the pike indeed. People were talking about it, trying to figure out its weight with the help of the photograph, to see how long and thick it is, and then people started saying that this story is a fake, because you were wearing the same clothes and watch as you did in the photograph made a few years ago. |
| В.Путин: Первая часть вопроса – это то, что выезжают. Вы знаете, у нас открытая страна, слава богу. И то, что человек имеет в нашей стране возможность выбрать любое место жительства и место работы, сделать это свободно, это очень большое достижение современной России. Нельзя людей обвинять в том, что они ищут для себя достойную работу и находят её, если находят, где‑то за пределами Российской Федерации. Наша задача не в том, чтобы «хватать и не пущать», как у нас говорят, а в том, чтобы создать самим, здесь, на территории Российской Федерации, достойные условия жизни и оплаты труда для высококлассных специалистов. В чём‑то нам это уже удаётся, где‑то пока нет. Я сейчас, только что, вернулся с Дальнего Востока, где во вновь открывшемся университете разговаривал со специалистами нового университетского медицинского центра. И там есть специалисты, которые вернулись из‑за границы, по‑моему, из Сингапура, вернулся доктор, причём он там был на хорошем счету, хороший доктор, хороший специалист. Я его спросил: «А что вернулись?». Он говорит: «Ну как, такие возможности, на таком оборудовании поработать, условия хорошие. Вернуться к себе на Родину, в среду родного языка, я это сделаю с удовольствием». То же самое происходит в некоторых научных сферах. Рабочая сила всегда, условно, конечно, я говорю, но люди, особенно с высокой квалификацией, всегда ищут места для наилучшего применения своих знаний и способностей – это абсолютно нормально. Мы должны работать в направлении возврата тех, кто уехал, и создания условий для работы тем, которые работают здесь, чтобы они никуда не уезжали. Для учёных – это лаборатория, место жительства, жилищная проблема, уровень заработной платы. Всё это не сделать в одночасье, всё это должно постепенно расти. Повторяю, что‑то удаётся сделать, что‑то пока нет, но мы знаем, в каком направлении нам нужно двигаться. Теперь по поводу выборов мэра Москвы. Кто бы ни был избран москвичами, федеральная власть будет работать с любым будущим мэром Москвы – это совершенно очевидный факт. Сегодня, правда, по всем социологическим опросам, лидирует исполняющий обязанности мэра Москвы Сергей Семёнович Собянин, у него не помню сколько, за 60 процентов, по‑моему. Причём такие цифры дают исследования самых разных независимых социологов – я думаю, что они объективными являются, даже не то что думаю, я даже не сомневаюсь в этом. Он очень опытный человек, спокойный, он не очень публичный, в известной степени даже молчун такой. Я люблю таких людей. Он меньше говорит, больше делает. Мне показалось, что люди это почувствовали, это очень важно. Люди, особенно с высокой квалификацией, всегда ищут места для наилучшего применения своих знаний и способностей – это абсолютно нормально. Мы должны работать в направлении возврата тех, кто уехал, и создания условий для работы тем, которые работают здесь, чтобы они никуда не уезжали. Для учёных – это лаборатория, место жительства, жилищная проблема, уровень заработной платы. Если же вдруг случится так, что кто‑то из оппозиционеров его обгонит в этом – ну что ж, так тому и быть, будет работать. Но работа по управлению таким мегаполисом, каким является Москва, требует знаний, требует большого опыта, навыков работы. Здесь недостаточно кричать «караул, держи вора!» или «мы завтра всех пересажаем в тюрьмы за коррупцию», или «мы завтра придём и всем раздадим по тысяче долларов для начала, а потом ещё по пять». Это, как правило, предвыборные всё агитки. А вот работать системно, спокойно, без шума и пыли, но добиваться результата, – это гораздо сложнее. Мне кажется, Собянин это умеет. Посмотрим на результаты. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: The first part of the question is that people are leaving. You know, we have an open country, thank God. And the fact that a person in our country has the possibility of choosing any place of residence and place of work, of doing this freely, is a very great achievement of modern Russia. One cannot accuse people of seeking worthy work for themselves and finding it, if they find it, somewhere outside the Russian Federation. Our task is not to "grab and not let go," as we say, but to create ourselves, here, on the territory of the Russian Federation, worthy conditions of life and of pay for high-class specialists. In something we are already succeeding; somewhere not yet. I have just now returned from the Far East, where at a newly opened university I talked with specialists of the new university medical center. And there are specialists there who have returned from abroad, I think from Singapore; a doctor returned, and he was in good standing there, a good doctor, a good specialist. I asked him: "And why did you return?" He says: "Well, such possibilities, to work on such equipment, good conditions. To return to one's Homeland, into the milieu of one's native language — I will do this with pleasure." The same thing is happening in some scientific spheres. The labor force always — conditionally, of course, I am speaking — but people, especially those with high qualifications, always seek places for the best application of their knowledge and abilities; this is absolutely normal. We must work in the direction of the return of those who have left, and of creating conditions for work for those who work here, so that they do not leave anywhere. For scientists this is a laboratory, a place to live, the housing problem, the level of wages. All this cannot be done overnight; all this must grow gradually. I repeat, something succeeds, something not yet, but we know in what direction we need to move. Now as regards the election of the mayor of Moscow. Whoever is elected by the Muscovites, the federal authority will work with any future mayor of Moscow — this is a completely obvious fact. Today, true, by all the sociological polls, the acting mayor of Moscow, Sergei Semyonovich Sobyanin, is in the lead; I do not remember how much, over 60 percent, I think. And such figures are given by studies of the most various independent sociologists — I think they are objective; I do not even just think it, I do not even doubt it. He is a very experienced person, calm; he is not very public, to a known degree even a silent type. I love such people. He talks less and does more. It seemed to me that people sensed this; this is very important. People, especially those with high qualifications, always seek places for the best application of their knowledge and abilities; this is absolutely normal. We must work in the direction of the return of those who have left, and of creating conditions for work for those who work here, so that they do not leave anywhere. For scientists this is a laboratory, a place to live, the housing problem, the level of wages. If it suddenly happens that one of the oppositionists overtakes him in this — well, so be it; he will work. But the work of governing such a megacity as Moscow is requires knowledge, requires great experience, skills of work. It is not enough here to shout "help, stop thief!" or "tomorrow we will put everyone in prison for corruption," or "tomorrow we will come and hand everyone a thousand dollars to start with, and then five more." These are, as a rule, all election leaflets. But to work systematically, calmly, without noise and dust, yet to achieve a result — this is much harder. It seems to me Sobyanin knows how. We will see the results. |
| Д.Данишевски: Я полагаю, что после того, как господин Навальный был приговорён к заключению, он был задержан, тогда много людей как раз и вышли на улицы, – это нормальное поведение по отношению к оппозиции? |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: I believe that after Mr. Navalny was sentenced to imprisonment, he was detained, then many people came out onto the streets – is this normal behavior towards the opposition? |
| В.Путин: Это отношение не к оппозиции, а к человеку, который допустил, по мнению правоохранительных органов, нарушение действующего закона. Ведь где этот господин ни появляется, там всегда он следит, как у нас говорят, всегда за ним какая‑то проблема: то спирт, говорят, или спиртовой завод там утащил, то с лесом какие‑то проблемы, то у него обнаружились фирмы за границей, он их не задекларировал. Это очевидный факт. Что касается того дела, о котором Вы говорите, я, разумеется, в деталях его не знаю, но знаю, что по этому делу есть обвинительные приговоры суда. И люди, которые получили обвинительный приговор, согласились с ним и даже отказались его оспаривать. Так что это не тот случай, когда просто оппозиционера хватают за то, что он власть ругает, там есть над чем подумать и о чём поговорить и суду, и правоохранительным органам в целом. Но оседлать модную тему борьбы с коррупцией – это ещё не значит уметь управлять городом 12‑миллионным и самому эффективно бороться с этой коррупцией. А вообще‑то, если человек говорит о борьбе с коррупцией, он сам должен быть прежде всего безупречно чистым. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: This is an attitude not toward the opposition, but toward a man who, in the view of the law-enforcement bodies, allowed a breach of the law in force. Wherever this gentleman appears, there is always, as we say, some problem trailing after him: now they say spirits, or that he carried off a spirits plant there, now some problem with timber, now firms turned up abroad that he had not declared. This is an obvious fact. As for the case you are speaking of, I of course do not know it in detail, but I know that in this case there are guilty verdicts of a court. And the people who received a guilty verdict agreed with it and even declined to contest it. So this is not a case of simply seizing an opposition figure because he abuses the authorities; there is something there for the court, and for the law-enforcement bodies as a whole, to think about and to talk about. But to mount the fashionable subject of fighting corruption does not yet mean knowing how to run a city of 12 million, and oneself fighting that corruption effectively. And in general, if a man talks of fighting corruption, he himself must above all be irreproachably clean. |
| Д.Данишевски: Думаете ли Вы, что оппозиционные партии в России поистине независимы или некоторым приходится в какой‑то степени работать с Кремлём, чтобы уживаться в сложившейся системе? |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: Do you think that opposition parties in Russia are truly independent or do some have to work with the Kremlin to some extent to live within the established system? |
| В.Путин: Так все работают, я думаю, что то же самое и в Соединённых Штатах, и в любой другой стране. Есть, конечно, ситуации и есть политические группы, которые предпочитают вообще никаких контактов не иметь. Но это путь в никуда, это путь к конфронтации и к беспорядкам. Но то, что у нас после принятия нами законов по либерализации деятельности политических партий в разы увеличилось количество партий, представленных на выборах различных уровней – в муниципалитеты, в регионы, – это факт, в разы там просто увеличение. Являются они независимыми или нет? Безусловно. Безусловно, полностью. Есть при этом политические партии, которые сами стараются наладить отношения с властью, стараются сделать её более конструктивной, стараются добиваться изменений в деятельности исполнительных органов власти. Есть те, которые просто критикуют и предлагают, как им кажется, более рациональные и эффективные способы решения проблем, перед которыми стоит регион либо страна в целом. Но то, что они являются независимыми, это очевидный факт. Вот Вы сейчас упомянули о некоторых наших оппозиционерах. Они что, разве они являются зависимыми? Или Вы их в этом подозреваете? |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: That is how everyone works; I think it is the same in the United States and in any other country. There are of course situations, and there are political groups, that prefer to have no contacts at all. But that is a path to nowhere, a path to confrontation and to disorders. But the fact that, after we adopted the laws liberalizing the activity of political parties, the number of parties represented in elections at various levels — in the municipalities, in the regions — increased several times over, that is a fact; there it is simply an increase of several times. Are they independent or not? Certainly. Certainly, fully. There are at the same time political parties that themselves try to arrange relations with the authorities, try to make them more constructive, try to achieve changes in the work of the executive bodies. There are those that simply criticize and propose what seem to them more rational and effective ways of solving the problems facing a region or the country as a whole. But that they are independent is an obvious fact. You have just mentioned some of our opposition figures. What, are they dependent? Or do you suspect them of that? |
| Д.Данишевски: Ну думаю, что существует определённая ручная оппозиция и более жёсткая оппозиция. И иногда степень их независимости разнится. Например, Навальный критикует существенно систему. И что ему нужно, чтобы преуспеть в этой системе? |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: Well, I think that there is a certain hand-picked opposition and a more hardline opposition. And sometimes the degree of their independence differs. For example, Navalny criticizes the system substantially. And what does he need to succeed in this system? |
| В.Путин: Этот господин оседлал очень модную тему борьбы с коррупцией. Повторяю ещё раз: для того чтобы бороться с коррупцией, прежде всего самому нужно быть кристально чистым. Но там есть проблемы. В этой связи у меня, к сожалению, есть подозрение, что это просто способ завоевать очки, а не истинное желание решать проблемы. Но не важно, Вы послушали бы, что говорят другие, например, председатели других партий, скажем, коммунисты, представленные в парламенте, как они критикуют власть, насколько жёстко, как иногда критикуют власть наши эсеры – у нас есть такая партия «Справедливая Россия». Или господин Жириновский иногда так наваливается на федеральную, а иногда на региональную власть, что мама не горюй, как у нас говорят. А те силы, которые не представлены в парламенте, их вообще десятки сейчас. Там даже и сказать трудно, кто, чего и как критикует действующую власть. Мне хотелось бы, чтобы не то чтобы критики было меньше, а хотелось бы, что она была лучшим образом литературно оформлена. Ну такая уж наша политическая культура. Думаю, что постепенно и здесь будут позитивные изменения. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: This gentleman has taken up the very fashionable topic of fighting corruption. I repeat once again: in order to fight corruption, one must first and foremost be crystal clean oneself. But there are problems. In this connection, unfortunately, I have suspicions that this is simply a way to score points, rather than a genuine desire to solve problems. But it does not matter; you would have heard what others say, for example, the chairmen of other parties, say, communists, represented in parliament, how they criticize the power, how harshly, how our SRs sometimes criticize the power – we have such a party as 'Fair Russia'. Or Mr. Zhirinovsky sometimes piles on the federal power, and sometimes on the regional power, so that mother does not worry, as we say. And those forces that are not represented in parliament, there are dozens of them now. It is difficult even to say who, what, and how they criticize the acting power. I would like it not so much that there were fewer critics, but I would like it that they were best literarily formulated. Such is our political culture. I think that gradually there will also be positive changes here. ] |
| Д.Данишевски: Говоря о политической философии, могу сказать, что Ваша политическая философия – загадка. Хотел бы спросить Вас, Вы консерватор, марксист, либерал, прагматик? Кто Вы, какова Ваша политическая философия? |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: Speaking about political philosophy, I can say that your political philosophy is a mystery. I would like to ask you, are you a conservative, a Marxist, a liberal, a pragmatist? Who are you, what is your political philosophy? |
| 19 Opposition Independence and Political Philosophy | |
| В.Путин: Я думаю, что вполне можно сказать, что я прагматик с консервативным уклоном. Мне, пожалуй, даже будет трудно это расшифровать, но я всегда исхожу из реалий сегодняшнего дня, из того, что происходило в далёком и недалёком прошлом, и пытаюсь эти события, этот опыт спроецировать на ближайшее будущее, на среднесрочную и отдалённую перспективы. Что это такое – прагматичный подход или это консервативный, – вы уж сами, пожалуйста, определите. По поводу выборов мэра Москвы. Кто бы ни был избран москвичами, федеральная власть будет работать с любым будущим мэром Москвы – это совершенно очевидный факт. Но работа по управлению таким мегаполисом, каким является Москва, требует знаний, требует большого опыта, навыков работы. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: I think it is quite possible to say that I am a pragmatist with a conservative lean. It may even be difficult for me to decipher this, but I always start from the realities of today, from what has happened in the distant and not-so-distant past, and try to project these events, this experience onto the near future, onto medium-term and long-term prospects. What this is – a pragmatic approach or a conservative one – you please determine for yourselves. Regarding the election of the Mayor of Moscow. Whoever is elected by the citizens of Moscow, the federal power will work with any future Mayor of Moscow – this is a completely obvious fact. But managing such a megacity as Moscow requires knowledge, requires great experience, skills in work. |
| Д.Данишевски: Думаю, многие люди с возрастом становятся консерваторами. |
Full house translation — pending review Д.Данишевски: I think many people become conservatives with age. |
| В.Путин: Наверное, Вы правы. И всё‑таки я думаю, что в этом есть определённый смысл, консерватизм – это совсем не значит застой. Консерватизм – это значит опора на традиционные ценности, но с обязательным элементом, нацеленным на развитие. Вот это, мне кажется, абсолютно принципиальная вещь. И, как правило, в мире, почти во всех странах, складывается ситуация так, что консерваторы накапливают ресурсы, накапливают средства, возможности для экономического роста. Потом приходят революционеры, всё это быстро делят так или иначе. Но революционеры – условно, это могут быть просто представители левых движений, левых партий или действительно радикальные люди, – потом всё быстро делят, всем это нравится. Потом наступает период разочарования: оказывается, всё уже съедено и испорчено, и надо бы опять зарабатывать. Люди это осознают и опять зовут консерваторов. Они опять впрягаются, начинают работать, опять чего‑то накапливать, потом им опять говорят: ладно, хватит уже, накопили, достаточно, пора делить. Вот такой круговорот в политике постоянный. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: Perhaps you are right. And yet I think there is a certain meaning in this; conservatism does not mean stagnation at all. Conservatism means relying on traditional values, but with a mandatory element aimed at development. This, I believe, is an absolutely fundamental matter. And, as a rule, in the world, in almost all countries, the situation develops such that conservatives accumulate resources, accumulate funds, and capabilities for economic growth. Then revolutionaries come, and all of this is quickly divided in one way or another. But revolutionaries—conditionally speaking—these can simply be representatives of left-wing movements, left-wing parties, or indeed radical people—and then everything is quickly divided, and everyone likes it. Then comes a period of disillusionment: it turns out that everything has already been eaten and spoiled, and one should start earning again. People realize this and again call for conservatives. They again get to work, start working, and again accumulate something, and then they are told again: 'Alright, enough already, you have accumulated enough, it is time to divide.' This is a constant cycle in politics. |
| К.Клеймёнов: Я хотел бы задать Вам вопрос на тему, которая активно обсуждалась в блогосфере после Вашего отпуска. |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: I would like to ask you a question on a topic that was actively discussed in the blogosphere after your vacation. |
| В.Путин: Про щуку, что ли? |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: About the pike, perhaps? |
| К.Клеймёнов: Во‑первых, все обсуждали щуку, её пытались взвесить на фотографии, посмотреть, какая она в толщину, на её длину, а потом стали обсуждать, что вообще ничего этого не было, потому что и одежда та же самая, которая была несколько лет назад на фотографии, и часы. |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: First of all, everyone discussed the pike, they tried to weigh it in the photographs, to see how thick it was, to look at its length, and then they started discussing that none of this existed at all, because the same clothes that were on the photographs several years ago were there, and the same watch. |
| 20 The Pike Story | |
| В.Путин: Часы у меня всё время одни и те же, а одежда, во‑первых, новая совсем. Она очень похожа, просто это охотничий камуфляж, но новая, приобретена была для этой поездки – это первое. Второе. Щуку я действительно поймал. Это первая моя щука в жизни вот такого размера. Там внутри у неё оказалась ещё рыбёха, внутри щуки, граммов на 250 или на триста. Поэтому, я думаю, она такая тяжёлая оказалась. Тащил я её три минуты, это всё зафиксировано. Я после этого изменил отношение к рыбалке. Я, честно говоря, был такой, ну, никакой рыбак. Но это породило у меня определённый интерес к рыбалке. Кстати говоря, поймал её на такую вот маленькую блесну, которую производит, по‑моему, малое семейное предприятие в Красноярске, называется оно «Царь‑рыба». Это маленькое предприятие. И блесна так называется: «Царь‑рыба». Я специально сделал фотографию и хотел отослать её производителям этой блесны, но всё не успеваю. Но надеюсь, что я это сделаю. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: I always have the same watch, but my clothes are brand new. First of all, they look very similar, it's just hunting camouflage, but new, acquired for this trip – that's the first thing. Second. I really did catch a pike. This is my first pike in my life of such size. Inside it, there was another fish inside the pike, about 250 grams or three hundred. Therefore, I think that's why it turned out to be so heavy. I dragged it for three minutes, this is all recorded. After that, I changed my attitude towards fishing. I was, honestly speaking, well, not a fisherman at all. But this sparked a certain interest in fishing in me. By the way, I caught it on such a small lure, which is produced, I think, by a small family enterprise in Krasnoyarsk, it's called 'Tsar-Ryba'. It's a small enterprise. And the lure is called: 'Tsar-Ryba'. I specifically took a photo and wanted to send it to the manufacturers of this lure, but I'm always too busy. But I hope that I will do it. |
| К.Клеймёнов: Какая реклама будет! |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: What kind of advertising it will be! |
| В.Путин: А поделом, они заслужили эту рекламу, потому что вот результат. Но я думаю, что здесь нет ничего удивительного, что такой никудышный рыболов, как я, поймал такую щуку, потому что там почти людей‑то нет, то есть не почти – там нет людей. Ближайшее жильё за 300 километров от этого озера, озеро высокогорное – на высоте 1700 метров, там нет никого, кто вылавливал бы эту рыбу‑то. Поэтому ну что там? Видимо, это не такая уж большая доблесть на самом деле. Но после этого я, пожалуй, займусь рыбалкой по‑серьёзному, мне понравилось. |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: They deserve this advertising, because here is the result. But I think that there is nothing surprising here that such a mediocre fisherman as I caught such a pike, because there are almost no people there, that is not almost – there are no people there. The nearest housing is 300 kilometers from this lake, the lake is high-altitude – at an altitude of 1700 meters, there is no one there who would catch this fish. So what is there? Apparently, this is not such a great achievement after all. But after that, I will probably get serious about fishing, I liked it. |
| К.Клеймёнов: Спасибо. |
Full house translation — pending review К.Клеймёнов: Thank you. |
| В.Путин: Вам спасибо большое. География Сирия Украина Темы Внешняя политика Партии Регионы Соотечественники Спорт Суд Экономика и финансы Ещё 3 |
Full house translation — pending review В.Путин: Thank you very much. Geography Syria Ukraine Topics Foreign policy Parties Regions Compatriots Sports Court Economy and finance More 3 |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified VLADIMIR PUTIN: We have no accurate information as to what has happened. We believe that we should at least wait for the results of the investigation conducted by the UN weapons inspectors. But we have no evidence that these chemical substances – it is not clear yet whether it was a chemical weapon or just some harmful chemical substance – have been used by the Syrian Army. Moreover, as I have already mentioned, in our opinion, it seems absolutely absurd that regular armed forces, which are currently on the offensive and in some areas have encircled the so-called rebels and are actually finishing them off, that in these circumstances they would start using forbidden chemical weapons while realising quite well that it could serve as a pretext for applying sanctions against them, including the use of force. It’s simply absurd, it’s illogical in the first place. ”If there are data that the chemical weapons have been used, and used specifically by the regular army, this evidence should be submitted to the United Nations Security Council. And it should be convincing.“ Second, we assume that if there are data that the chemical weapons have been used, and used specifically by the regular army, this evidence should be submitted to the United Nations Security Council – to the inspectors and the Security Council. And it should be convincing, not based on some rumours or information obtained by special services through some kind of interception or tapping or things like that. Even in the United States, there are experts who believe that the evidence presented by the Administration does not look convincing, and they do not rule out the possibility of a preplanned provocation by the opposition in an effort to give its sponsors a pretext for military intervention. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: As for the materials, video materials you have just mentioned, featuring dead children allegedly killed in the chemical attack, they are horrible. The question is only who did what, and who is responsible for this. The pictures themselves do not answer the questions I have just posed. Some think it is a compilation made by these very rebels, who, as we are well aware, and the US Administration acknowledges it, are linked to Al-Qaeda and who have always been distinguished by extreme brutality. At that, I would like to draw your attention to the fact that, if you have watched these videos carefully, they feature no parents, women or medical personnel. Who are these people and what has happened there? There is no answer to this question. And these pictures themselves are undoubtedly horrible, but they do not prove anybody's guilt. No doubt it is subject to investigation, and it would be good to know who is responsible for these atrocities. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: I do not rule that out, but I would like to draw your attention to one absolutely key aspect. In line with existing international law, only the United Nations Security Council could sanction the use of force against a sovereign state. Any other pretext or method to justify the use of force against an independent sovereign state is inadmissible and can only be interpreted as an aggression. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: Once we have objective and accurate data as to who has committed these crimes, then we will react. Assuming something now and telling things in advance like yes, we will do this or that, would be absolutely incorrect. This is not done in politics. Yet, I assure you that we will take a principled stand. I would like to say that our stand is principled because the use of weapons of mass destruction is a crime. On the other hand, yet another question arises. If it is ascertained that the weapons of mass destruction are used by the rebels, what will the US do with them? What will these sponsors do with the rebels? Will they cut off arms shipments? Will they launch military operations against them? Well, I think John Kerry said that anyone who stands by when these crimes are done will have to answer to history, and I’m sure you and Russia would be included, and the United States, but are you afraid that you may be seen today as standing by a regime that’s oppressing and committing crimes. Is there a danger that you will be seen as a protective of this government? |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: We do not defend this government. We are defending absolutely different things. We are defending the norms and principles of international law. We are defending modern world order. We are defending the possibility, the discussion of a possibility to use force only within the existing international order, international rules and international law. That is what we are defending. That is what represents the absolute value. When issues related to the use of force are dealt with outside the framework of the UN and Security Council, then there’s risk that such unlawful decisions might be applied against anybody and on any pretext. You have just said that Mr Kerry believes that chemical weapons have been used by Assad’s army, but the same point was used by another Secretary of State under President George W.Bush as he was trying to convince the entire international community of Iraq’s possession of chemical weapons and even showed a test tube containing some white powder. All these arguments turned out to be untenable, but they were used to launch a military action, which many in the United States call a mistake today. Did we forget about that? Do we assume that new mistakes can be avoided so easily? I assure you that is not the case. Everyone remembers those facts, bears them in mind and takes them into account when making decisions. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: It would take a deep and specific investigation containing evidence that would be obvious and prove beyond doubt who did it and what means were used. Then we will be ready to act in the most decisive and serious manner. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: Yes, of course. We do it and assume that we cooperate with a legitimate government without violating any rules of international law or any of our commitments. No restrictions have been imposed by the UN on the supplies of weapons to Syria. It is very disappointing indeed that the supplies to the rebels are being carried out in full since the very beginning of this armed conflict, although the international law prohibits the supply of arms to opposition groups. Please go ahead. S-300s are not the state-of-the-art systems. I think they are in fact somewhat better than Patriot, but we already have S-400 and we are close to completing the S-500 system. These weapons are certainly very efficient. We have a contract for the supply of S-300, and we have already supplied some of its components, but the delivery has not been completed, we have suspended it for now. However, if we see that steps are being taken that violate current international norms, we shall think how we should act in the future, including with regard to supplies of such sensitive weapons to certain parts of the world. I would like to draw your attention to the fact that at the moment Russia has no armed forces’ units deployed abroad, except for two bases located on the territory of the former Soviet Union and our peacekeepers taking part in operations under the UN mandates. It is very good, and we are pleased with that. We are definitely not going to and will not get involved in any conflicts. As regards the decision of some countries to abstain from participation in a military operation, it was actually a surprise for me, because I used to believe that the Western community is governed by the principle of certain uniformity similar to the decision-making principle used by members of the Communist Party of the Soviet Union. However, it turned out that it was not true. In fact, there are people who value their sovereignty, analyse the situation and have the courage to make decisions for the benefit of their own countries and defend their point of view. It is a very good sign, it shows that the multi-polar world order has indeed been strengthened. ”The purpose of the G20 summit is first and foremost to discuss global economic problems. However, bearing in mind that the situation around Syria remains acute and disputed, the leaders of 20 major economies of the world could definitely use the opportunity to spend some time discussing this issue at their meeting in St Petersburg.“ |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: First of all, I would like to say that the G20 summit agenda has been finalised long ago and that we have discussed this agenda with all our partners. We do not think that we have the right to act against these agreements. The purpose of the G20 summit is first and foremost to discuss economic issues and global economic problems, such as the issues of growth, fighting unemployment and corruption, tax offences and administration. However, bearing in mind that the situation around Syria remains acute and disputed and that we have not yet been able to reach an overall agreement on this pressing issue, the leaders of 20 major economies of the world could definitely use the opportunity to spend some time discussing this issue at their meeting in St Petersburg. We will not insist on it though, but we may propose to go beyond the scope of discussions planned and spend some time to consider the Syrian issue. I would like to emphasise once again that we will host the summit which has certain rules and an agreed agenda, so we do not think that we have the right to make any amendments to it on a unilateral basis. However, I will definitely invite my colleagues to discuss this issue. Hopefully, they will not refuse. What will you deem as a success of the summit? |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: The summit will be a success if there is an open and positive discussion aimed at finalising prepared decisions. What kind of decisions? I am talking about a set of measures aimed at boosting growth in the world economy and creating new jobs. These are two main tasks. At the same time, we believe that to fulfil these crucial tasks we need to accomplish several sub-tasks, in particular to promote investment, to make the world economy more transparent and to take action, as I have already mentioned, in the field of tax administration, in banking system, etc. Incidentally, as regards tax administration and improvement of tax system, it includes measures to prevent tax evasion, partially related to the fight against corruption. I think that we have been able to finalise (not on our own, but in cooperation with our partners and colleagues under the auspices of the OECD) the basic principles for the development of global tax system. No one has been able to do it over the last century. So, it is a very important component of our work. We have prepared the so-called “St Petersburg Action Plan” for the development of global economy and creation of new jobs. We have reached an agreement on some other issues, such as the fight against corruption and actions to eliminate tax havens. There is a wide range of measures to be taken. Of course, we will discuss the issues of global trade and global finance and will deem the summit to be a success if all documents prepared and agreed in advance are adopted. Did I get you right that, apart from initiating a discussion on these key issues, Russia has something to offer to our guests in terms of solving certain problems you have been talking about? |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: You see, a country’s presidency runs for one year, and the Group of Twenty summit is the culmination, the finale of all the joint work done during the year at the level of ministers, experts, etc. And of course during these joint discussions we proposed something and something was proposed to us. This was a joint work, a ‘joint kitchen’ where the cooked the ‘pie’ for all G20 leaders who are expected to sign the final documents. ”I would have liked the US President to visit Moscow, to have the opportunity to talk with him and discuss issues that have come up.We understand that the position of Russia on certain issues causes some irritation in the US Administration. I think it would be better not to get irritated but to be patient and work together to find solutions.“ |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: Are you working for a news agency or for the CIA? You are asking questions that are usually posed by colleagues from other agencies. Russia has certain plans if the situation develops according to the first, second or third scenario. We have our ideas about what we will do and how we will do it if weapons are used or not used. We have our plans, but it is too early to talk about them. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: Yes, of course, I would have liked the US President to visit Moscow, to have the opportunity to talk with him and discuss issues that have come up, but I see no particular catastrophe here. The fact is that contacts between our agencies, between heads of a variety of ministries have not ceased. Very recently, Russia’s Defence Minister and Foreign Minister have visited Washington. Our parliaments contact with each other. That means that the work is going on, it does not stop anyway. We understand that the position of Russia on certain issues causes some irritation in the US Administration. But we cannot help it. I think it would be better not to get irritated but to be patient and work together to find solutions. I really hope that on the sidelines of the G20 summit I will be able to talk to my American colleague. All our previous meetings have been very constructive. President Obama is a very interesting interlocutor; he is a practical, businesslike person. I am sure that even if the meeting will take place during our work on the sidelines of the G20 summit, it will be useful. In any case, there are a lot of issues we have been dealing with, and we are interested in solving them. They include the disarmament agenda, the development of the world economy, the issues connected with North Korea and Iran. There are many other issues and problems, and solving them is in the best interests of both the United States and Russia. For example, the problem of combating terrorism. Very recently, Americans have experienced a tragedy, I mean the explosions during a sporting event. And our law enforcement agencies and special services have been very actively cooperating with each other. Obviously, this cooperation serves the interests of both the American and the Russian people. This cooperation has not been suspended, and I am sure that it will continue to develop. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: I think that everyone in his activities, I mean those who are engaged in politics, economy, security, dissemination of information, everyone is trying to show their best qualities, including those observers you are talking about. Sometimes I read with surprise about the body language, about being bored or behaving in some other way. Who but ourselves can say what we have in our mind and soul? There are certain gestures which, of course, can be interpreted unambiguously, but nobody has ever seen neither me making such gestures at Mr Obama nor Mr Obama making them at me, and I hope this will never happen. Everything else is made up. I repeat once more, I have already said that: our conversations are always very constructive in nature, they are very substantive and quite frank. In this regard, the President of the United States is a very good interlocutor, he is easy to talk to, because it is clear what he wants, he has a clear position, he pays attention to the position of his interlocutor, his opponent, he reacts to it. It is interesting for me to work with him. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: That is partly true. But you know, first of all that concerns, I would say, the middle level of interaction in virtually all environments and spheres. Many people, especially in security agencies, who were working in the USA against the Soviet Union and in the Soviet Union against the USA for decades, remain in that system of coordinates and in that life. But I would really like to think that this does not have any effect at the highest political level. And our current disputes do not result from that – they probably stem from a different understanding of problems facing us, from different preferred means of achieving common, I repeat, common objectives and, of course, from ability or inability to find compromises and respect the opinion of partners. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: I don’t think I understand what arrests you are talking about that could have affected the election campaign in Russia. What kind of arrests could have taken place in Russia to affect the election campaign? I would be glad if you could clarify that. I have not heard about a single arrest that has affected the election campaign in Russia. There have been no such arrests. Our law enforcement agencies might have prosecuted somebody for something, but in such situations, there’s one very good defence method — cry out “Help! It is a political case!” I have not heard about any such cases. What is it exactly that you are talking about? |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: We sometimes do get thoughts like that, I’ll be frank with you, and I have told my American colleagues the same. I am not sure if it is the right thing to say this to the media, but anyway, it is obvious, so I will say this. I can hardly imagine the Ambassador of the Russian Federation to the US actively working with members of the “Occupy Wall Street” movement. I just cannot imagine such thing because the ambassador’s task is to improve state-to-state relations. It is a delicate job. Given the complexity of issues, there have to be people on both sides who know how to deal with sensitive issues, who seek compromise and achieve agreements. But as we have witnessed, people from the US Embassy acted in this very fashion; it is the same thing as if we worked, I repeat, with “Occupy Wall Street”. We don’t do this, but some employees from the US Embassy in Moscow think this is ok. In my view, it does not fit diplomatic norms. However, we did not go into hysterics but just took a detached view and thought, “well, if that’s the way they do it.” But it did not affect our relations in a negative way. I believe that such practice is wrong and destructive, but that is apparently the style of some of the senior officials at the relevant department. People come and go, but the interests of such big countries as Russia and the United States stay, and there is work to be done. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: No, at the level of intelligence services, things, of course, do go wrong too, like when we transfer some information and are told, “It’s all right. We will manage without your help.” And we say, “Ok then, if you don’t need it.” But on the whole, cooperation is developing successfully and is useful. I am convinced that it helps us save lives of our citizens, and this is the most important thing and the key result of our joint work in the area. I would like to once again express hope that we will manage to further extend and develop cooperation between our intelligence services.“the success of Russia as a state will essentially depend on how efficiently the people in municipal and regional entities will work. And if those people are inefficient, if they turn out to be those who try to gain power through some crafty schemes, it is certainly only going to damage the country as a whole.“ |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: Why? Is it a certain sign of where our relations stand today? |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: Well, this is something the American diplomacy does: they show support for the civil society. For me, there is nothing bad about it. On the contrary, we welcome this. It helps one fully understand what is going on in our society. It would though be very nice if the diplomatic service, the Embassy, security services – that is what they are for – provided a complete, and I mean complete and objective, view of the situation in the Russian society and if they did not look at it one-sidedly. However, it is also important to see how people dealing with human rights issues are organised and how they feel. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: No, it is just ongoing work, protection of national interests and principles of solving international issues and bilateral issues. It is a difficult and intense joint work. It’s true that this work is not laid with roses or other flowers. It is complicated and sometimes hard work, and there is nothing special about this. Anyway, President Obama was not elected by the American people to be pleasant to Russia, neither was your humble servant elected by the people of Russia to be pleasant to someone. We work, we argue, we are humans, and sometimes someone can get irritated. But I would like to repeat myself: I believe that global common interests are a good foundation for finding solutions together. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: People in Russia find it in general difficult to believe anything at all, and that is actually normal, people must always have doubts. The job of the authorities is to aim for a perfect result, though an election can probably never be perfect. However, the duty of the authorities, a matter of honour for every local official, election committees, and law enforcement is to organise everything properly so that people could objectively express their attitude towards candidates and the expression of will could lead to the formation of effective and efficient bodies of power. We are highly interested in this, because the success of Russia as a state will essentially depend on how efficiently the people in municipal and regional entities will work. And if those people are inefficient, if they turn out to be those who try to gain power through some crafty schemes, it is certainly only going to damage the country as a whole. ”We cannot judge whether Snowden committed a crime in the United States or not. But as a sovereign country that does not have an agreement with the United States on mutual extradition of criminals, we cannot do otherwise but to give him the opportunity to live here.“ While we are on the subject of objectivity and fairness, I would like to ask you about the court system, or rather some decisions taken within this system. Here is some, however, specific example: a mid-level official receives a suspended sentence for a proved embezzlement of about 400 million rubles, and at the same time a village teacher, who also manages a local club on a part-time basis, is sentenced to seven years of rigorous imprisonment and 3 million rubles penalty for giving a bribe of 400 thousand rubles. If I am not mistaken, he is the father of a large family. Well, you know, I do not even ask about the sense of these rulings. Of course, I understand that you cannot say that the delivered judgment was unfair. But it seems that it is certainly impossible to endure such state of affairs. The system must be changed. It is nonsense. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: You know, it might look like almost the same thing, but, according to legislators, these crimes, however, pose different danger to society. For example, the damage to a victim may be the same, let's say a million rubles. Someone had his million rubles stolen and someone was robbed of a million rubles. In this instance, robbery is a more socially dangerous crime committed with greater impudence. Despite the fact that the damage is the same for the victim, the punishment for the robber is still usually higher than for the one who stole, in this case, real and monetary assets in the amount of one million rubles. When a thief steals, he assumes that a victim does not see what he does, while the robber knows in advance that his victim sees and understands everything, but he, nevertheless, impudently commits this crime. The damage is the same, but the punishment may be different, and it is, by the way, justified. The example that you gave, is certainly not fully the same that I've mentioned. I gave an example with a particular name. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: Yes, I am just saying it may seem to be the same, but in fact, according to a lawmaker, these are different crimes. This case is, of course, outrageous. There are certain sanctions under which the judge personally chooses a specific decision on the advice of his colleagues, of course. There may be different assessments of danger to society. Bribe is a more socially dangerous crime than just a theft. Do you understand? This is an obvious thing. But there can be mistakes. For example, there is a death penalty in the United States. In all countries with death penalty, and we had it in our country too, there are numerous cases where after the execution it turned out that the person executed was not guilty. What can I say about it? We should shut down all courts or what? No, it is necessary to improve the judicial system, improve legislation, and make it more transparent, corresponding to reality and those social relations that are being governed by a certain law. These are the issues related to improvement of the judicial system. But it does not mean that it is not good at all and it should be destroyed. This is not the case, because the Russian judicial system has its deep roots. The Russian judicial system is an integral part of the international, global judicial system. Our law has very deep historical roots. It is a part of the continental European law, and many principles of our legal system and law enforcement practice are as good as, and in some way even better than the laws and law enforcement practice in other states. Yes, there are problems, and there are a lot of them, but we have to deal with them. Do you think Russian courts can be called independent? ”The Far East faced unprecedented disaster. Old residents cannot recall such floods. When I was flying by helicopter I had an impression that I was flying over a sea. The only thing that brings you back to wicked Earth are the rooftops that stick out of this ‘sea’. You immediately understand what terrible things are happening.“ |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: Russian courts are, of course, independent. When a judge does not want to be independent, there is no independence, and he can go to a governor or consult someone else, but I assure you that it happens almost everywhere. In general, if a judge takes a principled stand, no one can do anything with him. And I do not think that anybody would want to do it in current circumstances, because a judge is entrusted with authority and procedural rights. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: If it was really secret information and if such a person caused us some damage, then I would certainly seek his prosecution to the fullest extent permitted by Russian law. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: Probably, yes. You see, the problem is completely different. We do not know if the administration is right or not. The thing is not that we protect Snowden. We do not protect him at all. The problem is that we do not have an agreement with the United States on mutual extradition of criminals. We repeatedly suggested that the United States should conclude such an agreement, but we were refused. There are certain rules and procedures in the world, according to which a criminal can and must be handed over to the other party if there is an appropriate agreement where many issues are set out and certain guarantees are given. However, the United States refused to sign such an agreement with us. And they do not extradite our criminals who did not reveal just some secrets, but whose hands are stained with blood, who killed people, who traded in human beings, and our American colleagues are aware of it. We cannot judge whether Snowden committed a crime in the United States or not. We simply cannot do that. But as a sovereign country that does not have such agreements with the United States, we cannot do otherwise but to give him the opportunity to live here. I will now tell you something I have never said before. I have dropped some hints but have never said anything like that directly. Mr Snowden first went to Hong Kong and got in touch with our diplomatic representatives. I was informed that there was such a man, agent of special services. I asked them what he wanted and was told that this man was fighting for human rights and free flow of information, against violations of related human rights and law in the United States, as well as against violations of international law. I said: ”So what? If he wants to stay in this country, he is welcome, provided however that he stops any kind of activities that could damage Russian-US relations. This country is not an NGO, it has its own national interests and it does not want to sever Russian-US relations.“ This information was communicated to him. He said: ”No, I am fighting for human rights and I urge you to join me in this fight.“ I answered: ”No, Russia will not join him, let him fight alone.“ And he left, just like this. Then he took a flight to Latin America. I learned that Mr Snowden was on the way to our country two hours before his plane landed. What happened next? Information was leaked. No offence, but I think that US special services’ agents along with diplomats should have acted with greater professionalism. After they learnt that he was on the way to our country on a transit flight, they put all possible destination countries under pressure, all countries in Latin American and Europe. But they could have allowed him to get to a country where his security could not be guaranteed or intercepted him along the way – they did the same, by the way, with the plane carrying the president of one Latin American country, which, to my opinion, was absolutely unacceptable, done in a rude fashion inappropriate for the United States or your European partners. That was humiliating. The United States could have done the same with respect to Snowden. What stopped them? Instead, they scared everyone; the man quickly decided to stay in Russia’s transit zone and got stuck in our country. What were we to do after that? Hand him over to the United States? In this case we need to sign an agreement. You do not want to? All right, hand our criminals to us instead. You do not want that either? Good. Why would you then request extradition on a unilateral basis? Why so snobbish? Both sides need to take into account each other's interests, work together and look for professional solutions. ”We have no laws against people with non-traditional sexual orientation. Russia has adopted the law banning propaganda of non-traditional sexual relations among minors, but these are completely different things.“ So, we are defending specific norms governing state-to-state relations rather than Mr Snowden. I really hope that in the future, Russia and the United States will reach the relevant arrangements and formalise them as legally binding instruments. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: You know, I sometimes think about him, he is a strange type. He is a young man, just over 30, I cannot even imagine what he thinks. How is he going to live his future life? In fact, it is a hard life that awaits him. I cannot even imagine what he will do afterwards. It is clear, though, that we will not hand him over, he can feel safe here. But what is next? As time passes, the United States will probably understand that it has been dealing with a person who has certain beliefs that can be judged differently, rather than with a traitor or a spy. And some compromises might be found in this case. Do not ask me. It is his life and he has opted for it by himself. He believes this is noble and justified and that such sacrifices are necessary – it is his choice. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: I would like to remind you that sequester means slashing by a certain value of all expenditures without exception and irrespective of priorities. This sometimes happens in world economies and is due to some drastic changes in economic situation and negatives trends in the economy. It is not Russia's case, we are not in the negative, and there is a slight growth as compared to last year. The problem is that we have expected the economy to grow more significantly, and the higher the growth, the greater the budget revenue. And initially we planned to spend more resources on various projects. ”Certainly not during the Olympic Games or other mass sport events, especially the Olympics – one can be absolutely sure that Russia will faithfully follow the principles of Olympism, which do not admit any kind of discrimination, national, gender, or sexual one.“ Today, it has become obvious that the prediction is a bit different, the economy is growing indeed, but slower, so the revenue will be more modest, which means that we will have to spend money more carefully. This is not sequester; however, we need to come up with another forecast for economy's growth and outline the priority expenditures based on this forecast and the current reality. I think we will need to do some cutting. This, however, should be initiated by the Government during its work on the budget. This means that the expenditure items have not been yet defined? |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: Right you are. Do you know the risk we may run if it is not done? We will follow the steps of those countries that go into huge deficit and thus accumulate sovereign debt. If nothing is done, by 2014 our country will face certain deficit, next year it will be more serious, then even more than that and in the end we will find ourselves in a very difficult situation. If we are responsible, if we want to feel confident, probably a bit more modest during a certain period of our life, but nevertheless be sure that nothing collapses, blasts or falls apart then we should act carefully and professionally. That is what I am talking about. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: No, they should not. The people's incomes have been generally increasing. Probably not that fast and not for all the categories of population, but, despite the fact that the growth rate is below our expectations, the incomes increase. The Government will table a solution for the investment activities or, maybe, social sector, I do not know. Let me stress once again: this is a complex, multifaceted work. When it is done, the Government will put its proposals forward. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: I think about it myself. You know, recently I have watched a video where young guys “punish” drug dealers, catch them in the streets and so on. I myself have thought that, well, nobody knows about it, why these men must… They (drug dealers) were soaked in paint. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: …yes, these men must do it. It speaks to the fact that in some places this happens because the sharpness of vision is lost; in other places these things become routine, and still in others this is the result of corruptness of law-enforcement agencies. It is a combination of such reasons. Well, we just have to fight it. But the system is still hand-controlled? |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: In some respects it is hand-controlled, in others it functions in its normal, usual mode, but when it fails, one has to switch on hand control. Same as the situation in the Far East now, during this trip? |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: Not exactly. Here I cannot agree with you because the Far East faced unprecedented disaster. Well, old residents cannot recall such floods, it never happened before that water came up so high in Khabarovsk, Komsomolsk-on-Amur, in the Jewish Autonomous Area. You know, when I was flying by helicopter I had an impression that I was flying over a sea. The only thing that brings you back to wicked Earth are the rooftops that stick out of this ‘sea’. You immediately understand what terrible things are happening. The scale of the disaster is immense and that is why I think that President’s intervention is reasonable, it is adequate. The disaster is in fact immense, but exactly after you proposed that officials ate that balanda (gruel) which was given to people at the evacuation points, the situation … ”We should do everything we can to leave terrorists no chance of demonstrating their cruelty or carrying out their murderous activities and policy of hate. We take a wide range of steps aimed at ensuring security of the Winter Games. I strongly believe that our special services and law enforcement agencies will certainly cope with this task.“ |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: As you noticed, I did not stamp my feet there, bang my fists on the table, fire everyone at once. You see, the thing is this. People worked there day and night. Pay attention, thank God, there are no victims. God grant, there will not be. No marauding. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: No marauding, no crime, no rise in crime, etc. Generally, they worked day and night, saving people, evacuated residents from districts affected by large-scale flooding. They thought if people are evacuated to these army barracks, thank God, alive and healthy, it is good, we can deal with other things, but this is not good, it is impossible. It is impossible to throw people there, as they wrote, they themselves painted walls and ate balanda. I had to remind them, which is not an awful thing. I apologise to those people who were left in this state. If local officials have not apologised yet, I apologise instead, but we should improve the situation, set things in order. I think that a lot has already been done there, and nobody will have anything like that. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: I hope it will not have any negative implications, especially because we have no laws against people with non-traditional sexual orientation. You have said about it now, you kind of create an illusion among millions of spectators that we do have such laws, but we do not have such laws in Russia. Russia has adopted the law banning propaganda of non-traditional sexual relations among minors, but these are completely different things. Secondly, we see attempts being made to bring the future Olympic Games into discredit, including by exploiting this subject. Unfortunately, we see these attempts from the part of the United States as well. In this context, here’s what I wanted to say: in our country, first of all, the rights of people with non-traditional orientation are infringed neither in terms of profession, nor in terms of salary level, nor even, if they make achievements in art, work, they are not infringed even in terms of recognition of their results by the state; I mean they are awarded orders and medals. They are absolutely full-fledged and equal in rights citizens of the Russian Federation. Meanwhile, those who try to teach us, in particular some our colleagues and friends from the United States, would have to know that in the United States there are a lot of problems with people with non-traditional sexual orientation. Do you know, for example, that in some US states non-traditional sexual orientation is still deemed as a criminal offense? In particular, in Oklahoma, as I was told, and in Texas. Well, probably, those who told me that are mistaken, and you should double-check that. But if this is really true, the situation looks very strange indeed as those who cannot serve as an example try to teach us. As for statistics, some independent nongovernmental organisations keep such statistics, they assert, I do not say that this is true, but they assert that in some companies Americans with non-traditional sexual orientation are infringed even in terms of salary level, and they say such statistics exists. I do not know that, it should be checked. But the fact that non-traditional sexual orientation is deemed a criminal offense, you know, such atavism was eliminated long ago even in our country. We had, I think, Article 120 in the Criminal Code of RSFSR, which punished for non-traditional sexual orientation. Everything was abolished long time ago, we have nothing like that! But some countries do. But it seems to me we should better neither spar with each other, nor describe someone as a savage and others as civilised people, but approach the issues of respect for human rights in an unbiased, professional, partnership-like manner, and in this field we should not elbow but, giving an objective picture, seek solutions together. When the law says it’s a crime to do propaganda, would that include things like waiving a rainbow flag or painting your body in rainbow colours? Is that propaganda for young people? Will visitors and athletes have to have these kinds of concern? |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: No. In Russia, people who initiated these laws and who adopted this law (I, by the way, was not the initiator) assumed that homosexual marriages do not give children. Russia is going through hard times in terms of demographics. And we are more interested in full-fledged families and more children. It is not the main thing in the whole system of measures aimed at supporting demographic processes. But I think the authors of the law were guided by the need to solve demographic problems and were far from the idea of infringing anyone’s rights. And certainly not during the Olympic Games or other mass sport events, especially the Olympics – one can be absolutely sure that Russia will faithfully follow the principles of Olympism, which do not admit any kind of discrimination, national, gender, or sexual one, mentioned by you. You mentioned earlier, and my colleague did, that President Obama wants to meet with members of the LGBT community. Is it something you would consider doing in connection with these Games or in general? ”When a country hosts such major sporting events, no doubt, the number of persons engaging in physical culture and sports increases as compared to what was before the event. This is the main reason why we go to these expenses.“ |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: I have no objections, if anyone of them would like to meet, but no one has come up with such initiative so far. We have quite a number of groups, a variety of organisations, associations and I usually meet with everyone who asks for a meeting and raises an issue they believe should be discussed. Yet LGBT have not come up with such proposals so far. But why not? I assure you, I work with such people. Sometimes I award state medals and orders to them for their achievements in certain spheres. We have absolutely normal relations, and there is nothing special about it, I believe. Some people say Pyotr Tchaikovsky was homosexual, but we do like him, although for a different reason. He was a great musician and all of us love the music he composed. So what? One should not blow things out of proportion, nothing terrible is happening in this country. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: Terrorists always threaten someone. As soon as they make us fear, they win. Yet this is not supposed to mean that we should turn a deaf ear to their threats. We should do everything we can to halt these threats and leave terrorists no chance of demonstrating their cruelty or carrying out their murderous activities and policy of hate. Certainly, we take a wide range of steps aimed at ensuring security of the Winter Games. I strongly believe that our special services and law enforcement agencies will certainly cope with this task. What more could be done to ensure security? In this regard, cooperation with the colleagues from law enforcement agencies is pivotal. I should tell that we have relevant arrangements both with the US — the FBI and other special services — and European partners. All these people feel their responsibility before the athletes, sports fans and spectators. I hope that their joint work will be efficient and ensure complete and absolute security of the Sochi Winter Games. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: This country may have spent more to prepare for the Games in general, yet it has not invested more than any other country in the Olympic facilities themselves. A total of 214 billion rubles will be spent to prepare for the Olympics. One can easily calculate, how many dollars that would be, with dollar standing at 33 rubles today. Of those, 100 billion are contributed by the government and 114 by private investors. Even more money was invested in infrastructure. That was our conscious choice. We did it in order to make the south of Russia — and Russia is situated rather far towards the north — attractive and comfortable not only during the Olympic Games, but decades after them. We want our citizens to spend their money here rather than go abroad, to Turkey, Europe, Italy and so on for their vacations, and we want this region with good climate to offer them facilities for recreation all year round. We could very well do that without Winter Olympics. Yet you would understand that it would be complicated given that budget resources are constantly limited. However, when there are Olympic Games, we have no choice but to do this, and that, and that. More specifically, we have built hundreds of kilometres of new roads, dozens of bridges and tunnels. We have built two new roads (one of them was reconstructed, but in fact it was more like rebuilt, and the other one was built from the scratch) between the sea and the mountain cluster. We have built a railway line linking the sea shore and the mountain cluster. Besides, there are two new gas pipelines to ensure energy supply to the region. There is a power plant with 17 substations. We have built a new health care centre and 43 modern hotels to accommodate tens of thousands of people. I hope that all of these would benefit our people for decades. The money spent on that is not wasted, because it was spent to enable people of the Russian Federation to enjoy what has been done for decades. As I have already said, this is done for the people and not only to hold this major competition. Certainly, Olympic Games are interesting and prestigious, but this is not the main thing for us. Besides, there is something more that I believe is significant. I refer to promoting sports and healthy lifestyle. When a country hosts such major sporting events, no doubt, the number of persons engaging in physical culture and sports increases as compared to what was before the event. This is the main reason why we go to these expenses. How should we spend all these money but for the benefit of our people? We have incomes from our oil and gas and spend most of it this way. What’s more, you know, in 2008–2010, the time of economic crisis, the construction of Olympic facilities turned out to be a major anti-crisis measure, as we created several thousands of jobs there and engaged specialists from all the regions of the Russian Federation. We built towns there. This helps improve the quality and the level of our construction organisations and facilitates international cooperation (there were issues that were difficult to address). I expect very much that the teams of specialists formed in Sochi will at least partly be involved in subsequent infrastructure projects in different regions of Russia, including, possibly, in the south. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: It's not just the question of elites; in society, there are always some kinds of bacillus that destroy this social or public organism. But they become active when the immunity decreases, when the problems arise, when the mass of people, millions of people, begin to suffer. These millions already believe that things cannot get any worse, let's change something at any price, we shall destroy everything there, ”we shall build our new world, and he who was nothing will become everything.” In fact, it did not happen as one wished it to be. As for the loyalty or disloyalty of the elites, perhaps, it is possible that such a specific problem exists. I think, it was Pushkin – by the way, no one would suspect him to be a state or a tsar's satrap, on the contrary, he was a freedom lover, a friend of the Decembrists, and there is certainly no one who doubts it, — but even he once said, ”We have a lot of people who oppose not the government, but Russia.“ Unfortunately, our intelligentsia has such a tradition. But this is due to the fact that people always want to emphasise their civility, their level of education; people always want to be guided by the best examples. Well, maybe it's inevitable at some stage of development, but, beyond any doubt, this loss of the state self-identity both during the Russian Empire’s collapse and during the Soviet Union’s breakup was disastrous and destructive. We need to understand it in advance and prevent the state from being in the condition it was at the final stage of the First World War or, for example, in the last years of Soviet Union, when even soap was sold by coupons. Do you remember an anecdote when one family comes to visit another family and they ask their guests: - Do you take your tea with sugar? - Yes, with sugar. - Well, then, you will have to wash your hands without soap. You may laugh at it but it seems that people were thinking that things could not get any worse. But we all have to understand that once the revolutionary changes, not evolutionary, but revolutionary changes begin, then the things can become worse and much worse. And I believe that intelligentsia should be the first to understand this. And intelligentsia, realising it, should prevent from any abrupt steps and revolutions of different types and nature. We have just had enough; we have already experienced so much, both in terms of revolutions and wars that we need decades of calm and smooth development. ”Wherever Ukraine goes, anyway we shall meet sometime and somewhere. Because we are one nation. Because we have one Dnieper Kiev baptistery, we certainly have common historical roots and common destiny. We have common religion, common faith, and we have very similar culture, languages, traditions and state of mind.“ And as far as calm and smooth development is concerned, if you allow me, a question about Ukraine. Why doesn’t it work to develop calmly and smoothly together? Why cannot we create a common space with people, with whom we have been living side by side for centuries, and in fact we have a very similar state of mind? Indeed you often meet with the Ukrainian leaders. Where does the shoe pinch after all, in your opinion? |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: You know, no matter what happens, and wherever Ukraine goes, anyway we shall meet sometime and somewhere. Why? Because we are one nation. And however angry the nationalists from both sides can be with my words, and there are nationalists in our country, as well as in Ukraine, this is in fact true. Because we have one Dnieper Kiev baptistery, we certainly have common historical roots and common destiny. We have common religion, common faith, and we have very similar culture, languages, traditions and state of mind, as you have said correctly. Of course, there are some peculiarities and ethnic specifics in everything. By the way, the Ukrainian culture, Ukrainian language, dances and music are wonderful. I for one always admire it. And you have now mentioned the revolutionary events that took place after the First World War, I draw your attention to it, and we have talked also about the elites. And what is interesting? Both the White movement and the Red one were fighting against each other to death, millions of people died during the civil war, but they never raised the issue of separation of Ukraine. Both the Reds and the Whites proceeded from the integrity of the Russian state. As far as this part of Ukraine is concerned, it is a territory and we understand and remember that we were born, as I said, from the unified Ukrainian Dnieper baptistery, Russia was born there and we all come from there. It so happened that the part of this territory fell into the hands of different states situated to the west of these territories, and all these years, all these centuries the Ukrainian people experienced many privations, in fact, suffered and were in a humiliating situation. Only after the reunification of both parts of Russia, this part of Ukraine began to develop and, in fact, thrive. During the joint and unified coexistence Ukraine turned into a large European state having received additional territories, population and also due to Russia, due to some of its areas in the west. The Soviet Union made such exchanges and awarded these territories to Ukraine. They are in the south. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: Yes, in the south, it does not matter; anyway, it turned into a major state. Huge investments were made in the infrastructure, industrial development and so on. But nowadays it so happened that we live in different states. We should proceed from the reality; we should proceed from the fact that a great number of the Ukrainian people values its samostiynost’ , that is independence. One should not only accept it, but respect it. By the way, only with the respect for mutual interests and with just such approaches it is possible to address general issues of common interest. Regarding integration processes, we should treat Ukraine with respect as well. If Ukraine considers that it is necessary and reasonable for it to conclude, for example, a free-trade zone agreement with the European Union, let it be. But here we see some problems for us and for them. What are they? What do a free-trade zone and associate membership mean? I don’t remember the title of these documents, but I know their essence. ”You cannot blame people that they are searching for decent work and find it somewhere outside of the Russian Federation. Our goal is not to ‘grab and not let go,’ as we say, but to create here, in the Russian Federation, all by ourselves decent living conditions and salaries for highly skilled professionals.“ The bottom line is that Ukraine is taking additional commitments to reduce tariff protection and customs barriers. With respect to a large group of products – and what I’m going to say is clear, you even don’t need to be a specialist – Ukraine is slashing to zero import duties for a period of time, as for some other goods, it does this for all. This is the first point. Secondly, it introduces European standards and technical regulations. I will explain. When import duties are slashed to zero, foreign goods appear on the Ukrainian market, while its own production is functioning and needs to be sold as well. We are worried that they will be squeezed into our market, the market of the Customs Union, Russia, Kazakhstan and Belarus. We did not agree on that, it will create problems to our economy. This is the first point. And secondly, introducing technical standards at once, what does it mean? It means that Ukrainian enterprises will have to produce everything, for example, a lift, a car, a shirt, watches and other goods in compliance with technical regulations of the European Union. They are good, but very strict; making enterprises work in compliance with these regulations requires multibillion dollar investment, and time. I doubt that this can be done at once. And while this is being done, many enterprises will have already gone bankrupt or, once again, will squeeze goods into our market. We will be forced to close ourselves and that is the problem. Where this could lead? Our competitive advantages are clear: we have common transport infrastructure, energy, we have deep cooperation, common language. These are great competitive advantages, they will disappear. I can hardly imagine the development of the Ukrainian missile and space industries. They are rather significant, and the missile and aviation sectors. I just can’t imagine them without our market. For example, aircraft engines. All our helicopters have Ukrainian-made engines. What should we do? How will this develop, or it won’t at all? So the question is not whether we want or don’t want, keep or don’t keep. We have talks with the European Union as well. We are thinking about a free-trade zone, we are considering concluding a new framework agreement. I have known our European partners for a long time and know them very well, they are nice guys, I can have a mug of German beer with them, a shot of schnapps, a glass of delicious French or Italian wine. But when they sit down at the negotiating table, these people become very tough, pragmatic, getting something from them, you know, is a difficult task. So it seemed to me that if we defined some principles together within the common economic space, then it would be more difficult for the Europeans to talk to us as a Russian-Ukrainian-Kazakh-Belarusian Customs Union as a whole than as separate states, especially directly with just Ukraine. We’ll see what the Ukrainian leadership will choose. No matter what choice is made, we will treat it with respect and continue our work. But the question is just how we will be working, what we will need to do to protect our own interests. We’ll see. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: The first part of the question is about those who are leaving. You know, we are an open country, thank God. The fact that people in our country have the opportunity to choose any place of residence and place of work and do so independently, is a great achievement of modern Russia. You cannot blame people that they are searching for decent work and find it somewhere outside of the Russian Federation. Our goal is not to ”grab and not let go,“ as we say, but to create here, in the Russian Federation, all by ourselves decent living conditions and salaries for highly skilled professionals. We are making some progress on some issues, but are still trying to fix others. I just came back from the Far East, where in the newly opened University I talked with experts from the new university medical centre. There are specialists there who returned from abroad; there is a doctor who came back from Singapore, if I’m not mistaken, moreover, he was in good standing there, a nice doctor and a good specialist. I asked him, “Why did you come back?” He answered, “Well, it’s about good opportunities, a chance to operate such equipment, and work in fine conditions. A chance to return home, to the native language environment – I did it with great pleasure.” The same thing happens in some scientific sectors. Labour force, relatively speaking of course, people, especially highly skilled professionals, always seek for the best place to apply their knowledge and skills, this is absolutely normal. We must work to have those who left return and create conditions for those who work here and make them stay. For researchers this is a laboratory, a place of living, housing problems, and salary. This cannot be done all at once, it should develop step-by-step. Again, we are making some progress on some issues and still trying to fix others, but we know the direction in which we need to move. ”People, especially highly skilled professionals, always seek for the best place to apply their knowledge and skills, this is absolutely normal. We must work to have those who left return and create conditions for those who work here and make them stay. For researchers this is a laboratory, a place of living, housing problems, and salary.“ Now, regarding the election of the Moscow mayor. No matter who is elected by Muscovites, the federal government will work with any future mayor of Moscow, this is an indisputable fact. Today, however, according to the opinion polls the acting mayor of Moscow Sergei Sobyanin is in the lead, he has over 60% of votes. I don’t remember exactly the number. All these figures come from different independent sociologists, I think they are objective, I even don’t doubt them. He is very experienced, calm, not too public and to some extent a silent type. I like such people. He speaks less and makes more. It seems to me that people feel this, and it is very important. If someone from the opposition happens to overtake him, let it be so, he will be working. However, great experience and skills are required to govern a metropolis like Moscow. It is not enough to shout ”Help, stop thief!“ or ”Tomorrow we will put everybody in prison for corruption,“ or ”Tomorrow we will come and give $1,000 to each of you, and then another $5,000.“ It is usually all pre-election agitation. But to work systematically, quietly, without any scandal and fuss is much more difficult. I think Sobyanin knows how to do this. We’ll see the results. Mr Navalny. I believe that thousands of people came out spontaneously after his sentence to prison, and the next day he was released on bail. Is that normal in this country that court responds to protests like that? Were you surprised by that decision? |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: This is not an attitude towards opposition, this is an attitude towards a person who has committed, according to law-enforcement agencies, violation of the law. Wherever this gentleman appears, he is always watching something, as they say, he always brings trouble with him: it’s either an alcohol issue, or an alcohol plant being stolen, or some forest-related problems, or he claims to have found out about some companies operating abroad, the ones he had not declared. It is an obvious fact. Speaking of the case that you have mentioned, I am not familiar with the details, but what I do know is that there are guilty verdicts in this case. Moreover, people who had been declared guilty agreed with it and refused to challenge the court's decision. Therefore, this is not the case when an oppositionist is being arrested for criticising the authorities; there are things worth thinking over and discussing by the court and law enforcement agencies in general. However, the ability to get on the popular topic of corruption does not mean the ability to govern a 12-million citizen city and the ability to fight corruption on your own. By the way, if a person raises the topic of corruption, he himself has to be a man of sterling character. Do you think that the opposition parties that exist here in Russia are truly independent or does everyone to some extent need to work with the Kremlin to get along in the political system that exists now? |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: This man has harnessed a very popular topic of corruption. As I have already said, one has to be a man of sterling character in order to fight corruption. Unfortunately, this is why I suspect that this is just a way to score some points, not a true desire to solve problems. But anyway, you should have heard what other party presidents, for example, the communists or Fair Russia (which is one of our political parties) supporters, have to say about the authorities, the way they criticise them. Mr Zhirinovsky sometimes criticises the federal or the regional authorities very drastically. There are dozens of parties that are not yet represented in the parliament. I do not want there to be less criticism, I just want it to be formulated in a more literary language. Oh well, so much for a political culture in our country. I think that with time we will see positive changes in this direction too. On political philosophy, I think your political philosophy is still something of a mystery. I just want to ask you are you a liberal, are you a conservative, are you a Marxist, are you a pragmatist. What are your political guideposts? |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: I guess I can call myself a pragmatist with a conservative perspective. It would be hard for me to explain this, but I always take realities of today, lessons from the distant and recent past into consideration, I try to take these events and this experience and project them into the future, in the medium and long-term perspective. Please, define for yourself whether this is a pragmatic or a conservative approach. Well , |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: I guess you are right. However, I still think that it makes sense, conservatism does not mean stagnation. Conservatism is based on traditional values, but at the same time it has one essential element, which is a goal for development. I think it is of fundamental value. It is common practice for conservatives in all countries to accumulate resources and provisions for economic growth, and then the revolutionaries come and portion it all out one way or another. However, representatives of leftist movements or parties and radicals can also be revolutionaries, they portion everything out and everyone is happy. Then comes the moment of disappointment – as it turns out, everything has been eaten and ruined and it’s time to start accumulating again. People realise this and turn to the conservatives again. The latter start working again, accumulate something, but then they are told that it’s enough and the time has come to portion it out again. So this cycle is an integral part of the politics. Do you mean the pike? |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: First, I always wear the same watch, but the clothes are new. It does look alike, but only because it is a hunting camouflage, but it is new, it was bought for this trip. Second, I really did catch that pike. For the first time in my life I caught a pike this big. There was a 250–300 gr fish inside the pike. I believe this is why it was so heavy. I was trying to fish it out for three minutes, the process was recorded. This experience changed my attitude towards sport fishing. I was not very enthusiastic about fishing, but this catch made me change my mind. By the way, the pike was caught on a small plunker manufactured in Krasnoyarsk by a small family enterprise called “Tsar-ryba”. It’s a small enterprise. The plunker itself is also called “Tsar-ryba”. I deliberately made a picture and wanted to send it to the manufacturers, but I don't have the time. Hopefully, I will do that some day. That would be one good advertisement! |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: So be it, they deserve this advertisement, their product is working. I but do not think it’s so surprising that such a bad fisherman as myself caught such a pike, because there are almost no people there. Actually, there are no people there. The nearest settlement is 300 kilometres away from this lake, it is a mountain lake located at an altitude of 1,700 meters. There was no one there to fish it out. So it wasn’t that hard really. Apparently, it was not actually heroism after all. However, I will probably start fishing professionally after that day. I really enjoyed it. Thank you. |
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Cached English source — passage alignment not verified Vladimir Putin: Thank you very much. |